ok now lets talk about something far more interesting than those topics ..
Ok 2d games & 3d games ... what do u think which one is better .. in this space age more than 89% of COMPUTER / VDG users like to play 3d games like Midtown Madness . Red Faction GTA 3 . e.t.c e.t.c .. and 2d games are for newely born kids . So why do we serve here 2d games how about making this site a 3d game site where only 3d games will be serves .. click team must make some other 3d games making software like GAMES FACTORY OR MULTIMEDIA FUSION . and stop making those softwares like JMAGIC in which we have to write several lines of code whether C++ or JAVA dosen't matter.both are languages ..
So what do u think?? about this topic ..
I think the site must be immediately updates for 3d games . ..
So in short i want the biggest change in the history of this site . ..
One more thing i'am sure users here download and upload games but they just download them to see how the other users have created their games and they donot play the game seriously .. They just download the game .. see the KOOL Graphics .. or maximum play one or two rounds and not more than that .. ..
So if we start serving 3d games this site will be a better place to visit ..
HOW'S THAT???
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I think the easiest answer is that I couldn't care less whether a game is 2D or 3D so long as it is fun and challenging. That said, there seems to have been a gradual decline in game quality since the 3D revolution, but there is no direct corrolation. I'm not going to sit here and claim that Metal Gear Solid or Halo aren't good games because they are 3D-- that'd just be stupid. To me, videogaming has had a pair of heydays -- the first being from the release of the NES in the mid 80's through the 16-bit era of the early 90's, and the second one being the 2-year span that the Dreamcast was around. One was 2D, one was 3D, but both were times of exceptionally good and innovative games.
Generally, I find that gameplay is substituted for graphics in 3D games. While of course I have my favourite 3D games (Ocarina of Time, Super Mario 64, Majoras Mask, Super Smash Bros. Melee etc), I prefer the old classics. Secret of Mana, Zelda, Secret of Evermore, Lufia, All Mario and Sonic games, Terrinigma etc.
Show me the power child,
I'd like to say,
That I'm down on my knees today,
Gives me the butterflies,
Gives me away,
'Til I'm up on my feet again,
I'm feeling outshined.
I miss the old classics like Mega Man 2 and Demon's Crest. 3D can be cool but the 2D sprites look so much cooler. 3D has had it's run but 2D must return!
Death in the air
Strapped in the electric chair
This can't be happening to me
Who made you God to say
"I'll take your life from you!!"
i still think that 2d games are for newely born kids .. .. My dream game will be the game which i first saw in Johnny Quest ( a cartoon ) in which a small ray type thing comes in front of our eyes and we log on in a big 4 Dimensional world . we hit people while moving our own real hands and we also do the same things in the game with different types of weapons .. .. what do u guyz think??
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i already mentioned that click team must make a software like Games factory for creating 3d games .. I never said that a newely born kid can create even 2d game
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Obviously it depends on the type of game, though - for example, I think the GTA and Sonic games worked a lot better in 2D than 3D (although GTA was always quasi-3D anyway - sprites on top of a polygonal backdrop).
Anyway, are we talking about 2D/3D graphics or gameplay? 2D-play games are certainly viewtiful in 3D, but it really just comes down to a waste of processing. By the same token, 3D-gameplay games with 2D sprites are awful, take Chameleon Twist for example.
As far as gameplay goes, I've peen playing through the entire Megaman series lately. And Ghouls 'n' Ghosts, Deamon's Crest, Actraiser, SNES Shadowrun, GradiusIII/R-TypeIII, and Genesis Taz-Mania. You can't tell me those are for "newely born kids." If the only thing that can draw your attention is graphics, then anything by Konami or Capcom in the latter SNES years blows the first five 3D years and beyond out of the water.
Anyone played The Divide? PSX and PC I think. It's on my shelf right next to Heart of Darkness. TD has crappy graphics, horrible gameplay, and is in full 3D. Yet, when MMF3D comes out, I think it will be a long time before we see a player-developed game that tops it. HoD, on the other hand, was released after TD, and is full 2D. It has beautiful graphics, and fantastic gameplay. The team who worked on HoD worked previously on Another World (called Out of This World in USA, I think), and later on Abe's Oddesey. Another World had flat, vector-based 2D graphics, but it's still one of my favourite titles of all time.
Hmmm, the only MMORPG that were 2D I knew were Dransik and Ultima Online, oh and Lineage. Ragnorok was in 3D and the asheron call games too, same with World of Warcraft etc.
I've never played a good MMORPG besides Phantasy Star Online in either 2D or 3D. It's a genre that just doesn't appeal to me for some reason. I guess I value story too much in my RPGs...
I agree with Mr.Coffee. Some games have to be in 3d to work. I can't imagine playing HalfLife in 2d somehow. However, platform games do still (in my opinion) play better in 2d, and RPGs can easily get away with 2d.
2d will always have a place in the gaming industry... it's just not the *only* place anymore. It's like the horse and the car. When the car arrived on the scene, people didn't go arround massacring horses because they no longer needed to ride them to get to work or to pull carts, they just rode in their leisure time instead. 2d is going this way.
Ok now lets see ... think that u r playing halflife or counter strike in 2d .. how does it feels?? .. it looks like we will kill our self after playing that thing .. now thing .. the famous 2d game .. Sonic 1 .. think or playing that game in 3d... What do u think about this 2d 3d problem? ...
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I'm not entirely sure what your point is (I can barely read it to be honest)... are you saying that games designed for 3D definitely won't work in 2D, whereas games originally in 2D have a chance of working in 3D as well?
The second dimension is clearly the best in my mind. For most things that is. There are some occasions when 3D is necessary (football games, shoot 'em ups), but most of the time 2D will do just fine.
I think 2D is making a comeback with games like Viewtiful Joe (I know it's not entirely 2D, but the gameplay is on one line).
I'd say 3D & 2D kind of match only because 2D lets the designer to express them selfs easyly with pixel by pixel art.
Though were 2D platformer games can have a really nice look, I mean look at Enternal Daughter!
But games like Super Smash Bro. Melee, is shows that a 3D platformer can have a really nicely done 2D/3D feel. I love those. If only they would use that idea for a new Sonic game like Sonic The Hedgehoge 1,2,2,S&K, & so on. Cause I thing the new 3D Sonic games are good, but they can't compair with the classic platformer games in my view.
In my personal oppinion it is impossible to say wether 2d or 3d is best. It really comes down to what game you want to make (genre) as it has been mentioned before in this topic.
Some games gain from 3d and some dont.
2d is a allround good format that can be used in any game. Its strenght is its simplicity and its weakness is its limitation. Its quite easy to draw sprites and show them on screen layered for more depth. However the 2d perspective makes limitations as only 2 dimensions can be shown at a time.
3d has an advantage over 2d. Its strength is its simulation and its weakness is its complexness. 3d simulates the real world well as both are 3 dimensional. The downside is it is more complex to create a 3d world than a 2d world (obviously as you only have to create 2 dimensions for 2d and 3 for 3d).
3d will always win when it comes to simulating. First/third person racing, flying, shoot'em'up games etc. These games can do a much more realistic simulation of a world due to 3d.
Games that do not simulate a world have no use of 3d. Side scrollers are not supposed to simulate a real world. A card game can do just as good in 2d as 3d if its just about the cards.
Both 2d and 3d games can be good, challenging, innovative etc. etc.
It is truly a pitty that 2d is abandoned by major game creators.
I think dave c is right about klikkers making 3d games. Making 3d games will never be as easy as making 2d games. There will be many games with ugly 3d models containing too much polygons cuz of meshsmooting, with huge textures. making 3d gfx is a lot harder to learn compared to 2d gfx, and it takes a lot more time.
on the other hand, imagine a 3d game by Jannis Stoppe or Jonathan Smeby...
"Say you're hanging from a huge cliff at the top of mt. everest and a guy comes along and says he'll save you, and proceeds to throw religious pamphlets at you while simultaniously giving a sermon." - Dustin G
most 3d games are bad, but not all, some of them are alot better than 2d (especially real 3d strategy games)
"I can't imagine playing HalfLife in 2d somehow"
why would anyone want to play halflife at all?
"If Darl McBride was in charge, he'd probably make marriage unconstitutional too, since clearly it de-emphasizes the commercial nature of normal human interaction, and probably is a major impediment to the commercial growth of prostitution."
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I just started playing Sonic 3 again (on Sonic Mega Collection - which is on GameCube) and it's still bloody brilliant. Better than all the Mario 3D games put together.
You can't just sit down and say, right, *D is better. There a some very good 2D games and the are some very good 3D games. If a game is well programmed, chalenging and makes the player want ot play more then its a good game, whether its 2D or 3D.
"Say you're hanging from a huge cliff at the top of mt. everest and a guy comes along and says he'll save you, and proceeds to throw religious pamphlets at you while simultaniously giving a sermon." - Dustin G
what are you talking about?? 3D games have one extra dimension, and it's called 'depth'!!
"Say you're hanging from a huge cliff at the top of mt. everest and a guy comes along and says he'll save you, and proceeds to throw religious pamphlets at you while simultaniously giving a sermon." - Dustin G
I'm not against the idea at all, 2D is cool, but I just love 3D more....
One problem, how are you going to accomplish this, how can click user create 3D games, it means you would need to switch to Jamagic or so to accomplish the goal.
If all (or many) of us switch to Jamagic to create 3D games for the new Daily Click 3D, Clickteam will most likely never release MMF 3D, simply because due to the fact that Jamagic is the #1 selling Clickteam software. They will put all of their effort into JM most likely....
3D is good for some things but control can be harder and more complicated.
2D is good for some things and it's easy to control by its nature. Gameplay can be more simplistic.
But then do you really care how many dimensions it has if the game is fun? I can think of many 2D games that would be rubbish in 3D, and lots of 3D games could never be made 2D. It's down to whatever suits the gameplay.
I like 2d more because when all you have to do is draw graphics, when you code you have to model, skin and above all else go through the tedious task of animating with a crappy camera, with 3D you have so many other things If you hope to get a game out at a nearby date you have to skimp on gameplay, and it's opposite for 2d yet you can make "pretty" graphics hundreds of times easier leaving more time for gameplay.
Let's put it this way...
Your keyboard has only four arrows. Most controllers can just move in 8 directions (and anything in between) at best. How the hell can you fully control a 3D game with just 2D controllers (and up-down buttons)?!
3D is good for simulations and racing things where you don't need the extra control. It's better if you control everything by mouse. But when you need to move 'diagonally' then the game's better off in 2D. Examples: Prince of Persia, Sonic.
BTW, 3D is a lot easier graphically than 2D if you have the right tools for it. In 2D, you need to make several different guys with different equipment to make them look like they're using different weapons. In 3D, you just have to add a few polygons to it. These days, 3D CRPGs are a dollar a dozen (almost literally).
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
I would just like to note that Prince Of Persia: The Sands of Time is a damn fine game -- and it's in 3D. A good example of 2D to 3D done right, unlike the last time the series attempted it.
I dunno. Sands of Time felt too easy, IMHO. The 2D versions had much better combat. Haven't won it, so maybe it gets harder later. But it's visually MUCH better than the 2D versions.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
I dunno. Sands of Time felt too easy, IMHO. The 2D versions had much better combat. Haven't won it, so maybe it gets harder later. But it's visually MUCH better than the 2D versions.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
'So if we start serving 3d games this site will be a better place to visit ..'
The only reason people keep playing 3D games and toss their klik 2d games away (even the quality ones)is, in my opinion, because theyve paid for the 3D game and they wanna finish it and get their moneys worth. If the DC charged for every download I can assure that we would all finish every game we get otherwise we would be wasting our money.
When it comes down to it, it really makes no difference, you cant say every 2D game sucks or that every 3D game sucks, judge every game on its individual merits.
P.S i think Mario 64 is rubbish compared to the originals, it tried to complicate it too much by giving mario too many different moves, and it often opted for a 2D veiw when climbing mountains and what not, this was annoying because it seemed inconsistent. This critism is, ofcourse got nothing to do with my preference of 2D over 3D, its got to do with my preference of fun games over ribbish ones.
'oh yeah? he's thrown a kettle over a pub, what have you done?'
Really, it doesn't matter whether the game's in 2D or 3D. It all matters on how the creators put together the game. Sometimes all that effort to make a 3D game costs it its other qualities. Black & White was a good 3D game. The Spirit Engine was a good 2D game. 2D or 3D is just a gaming style, like anime or retro.
People don't really toss away a good klik game. At least I don't. I *still* play Siege even though I've mastered the game.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
3D games are harder to program and make, but they turn out being a lot cooler in my opinion. However, it can be made to imitate a 2D interface, while a 2D interface cannot really mimmick 3D. Take Kirby 64 for example. It uses 3D but it plays like an SNES Kirby game.
However, I don't think we should switch to 3D just yet. Very few of us users here have Jamagic or another 3D programming language (Even though I do! ). I can't exactly do 3D modelling yet anyways.
Project Progress:
1.: Droid Runner (5% Complete)
Finishing Up Game Engine
You cant really make a decent 3D game unless you use a really expensive program like top game comanies use, or you are clever enough to write your own that does it all for you, again, like top game companies use.
until you are that good, dont bother, stick with 2D because the game play will be alot better.
Old games or new arcade/puzzle games rox. For example Popcap's games (www.popcap.com) they rock. And they are not ver 3D. Old games Pizza tycoon also rox!!!
I personally like 2D games. I made two games in TGF: a 2D- Adventure game and an isometric platformer. I fond out I had a lot of time to wrok on the game with the 2D, while spent mst of my time on the graphics in the iso. At my deadline, I stopped production on both and tested them. The adventure was much, much better.
Heart Break Kid, your comment about the site and 3D is stupid, especially because you're too lazy to learn code. If you actally wanna make a good 3D game, then learn C++. I haven't because I don't have enough time.
Remember, there's a little darkness in all of us... we just express it best.
--Ragnarok Games
You can't say all 2d games are bad because they are outdated. That's like saying, I dunno, terrestrial TV is bad because we've got sattelite now. Basically what you are saying is, because it's 2D, it's got bad gameplay, no fun etc. Wrong. It depends on the game. So yeah, GTA 3 was much more fun that GTA 1+2, but thats because it was designed in the same way by the same people. Look at the gameboy, it's a hugely popular console, loads of kids have them, and the majority of games are 2D. Have you actually played games on this site?
I work in some 3D languages and it is a lot more difficult than 2D too. I know MMF 3D is coming, but do you really think that adding another dimension is that easy in terms of point and click? If you want a crappy game creation tool that can do 1 genre of only 3D games, go get the 3d games creator, and leave us alone. We're happy.
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