The Daily Click ::. News
 

New Release: Big Sky
News posted 10th December, 2010 by The Chris Street  
A little bit of exciting news for you - James Whitehead has released his psychodelic shoot-em-up Big Sky at the humble Boss Baddie website, where the game can be purchased for £4.99 via GamersGate.

If you're wondering what the Satan Sam creator has in store for you, he's kindly supplied the world with a video. And yes, this is an MMF2 product.

Click here to view the video and purchase the game!




Posted by UrbanMonk 10th December, 2010

Looked decent, but the enemies didn't seem to have any kind of patterns.

Plus I'm pretty sure that the video loops about half way through since the enemies looked the same.

):

I guess I'd have to try it to really give a fair judgment.
 
Posted by Ski 10th December, 2010

haha another video? No demo again?

Edit: Why wouldn't this be a MMF2 game?
Comment edited by -Adam- on 12/10/2010
 
Posted by Del Duio 10th December, 2010

So is Tormishire for sure abandonware or is he going to start it up again later, anyone know?
 
Posted by OMC 10th December, 2010

Looks pretty, but since the last two Boss Baddie games were slow on my computer, I wish it had a demo so I could see if this would be too.
 
Posted by Marko 10th December, 2010

That looks absolutely beautiful - i'll be buying that based upon the video for sure tomorrow
 
Posted by MJK 10th December, 2010

If it costs £1, you don't need a demo. Just buy it if it looks promising. It's £1 = practically free.
 
Posted by Ski 10th December, 2010

Im not paying £1 for a bunch of ink effect/pixel shader particles and a somewhat basic looking space shooter.
 
Posted by s-m-r 10th December, 2010

The system requirements are posted by the listing on the website, so perhaps you can use that as a guide regarding how it will behave on your own system. The requirements certainly seem hefty to me, but expected when considering the particle effects used. I imagine it would be quite choppy on any integrated chipset.
 
Posted by OMC 10th December, 2010

My computer meets those requirements, and did for the other two games as well.

Actually now that I think about it, Wake was playable. I think it was just Lunnye that wasn't.
 
Posted by Silveraura 11th December, 2010

Looks pretty decent. Adam's jealousy brings me giggles.
 
Posted by Ski 11th December, 2010

Well, Id put it on a par with your diamond game, all special effect and no real substance. And by that comparison I remain far from jealous.
 
Posted by GamesterXIII 11th December, 2010

Diamond has come a long way from the olden days.

This game looks pretty boring. I might buy it to delete it after 10 seconds.
Comment edited by GamesterXIII on 12/11/2010
 
Posted by Hayo 11th December, 2010

It actually does look like a fairly normal space shooter made with ink effects to me. But I guess that's the new trend in indie games now. Short flashy things.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 11th December, 2010

@Brandon: If there are professors specialising in this sort of stuff, I would be surprised if you asked them their opinion on somebody else's game bar you own. I smell something, and it doesn't smell good!

It does look like mutton dressed as lamb to me I'm afraid. I would rather play Xenon 2 by the Bitmap Brothers.
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/11/2010
 
Posted by Duncan 11th December, 2010

The weapon editor (?) looks pretty hardcore!
 
Posted by nim 11th December, 2010

Apparently it's been taken down because of piracy. Maybe some people wouldn't be so keen to pirate it just to try it out if he'd released a demo.

Edit: Also noticed the lack of enemy patterns. Do the enemies always move in straight lines? Maybe if he'd released a demo I'd be able to find out.

Edit2: If you don't use an XBox360 controller do you use the mouse to shoot or 8-dir keyboard? Maybe I'd know the answer to that if he'd released a demo.
Comment edited by nim on 12/11/2010
 
Posted by OMC 11th December, 2010

I could swear there's some kind of subliminal message in there, but it's just out of my reach...
 
Posted by Johnny Look 11th December, 2010

It's only 1£ and judging by the video it looks like a classic shmup with a really good presentation.
A demo would be nice, but I think the video is pretty much all you need to make up your mind.
You either like shmups or you don't, and it'a not like buying this game is a big investment.
 
Posted by Ski 11th December, 2010

Brandon I studied Animation for 3 years, I dont go around claiming to be a fantastic animator.

The fact that you're studying something to do with games design/games design doesn't make you any better or more talented than anyone else here. Clearly.
 
Posted by Hayo 11th December, 2010

I completed 2 studies and I am still a moron too.
 
Posted by Pan-tosser 11th December, 2010

I like it but I'm with Adam I'm not buying it. James puts together some really nice colors in is art. You got to give him that much.
Comment edited by Pan-tosser on 12/11/2010
 
Posted by Ski 11th December, 2010

You can give a 5 year old finger paints and they will too
 
Posted by Rikus 11th December, 2010

Looks kinda cool! I am a sucker for pretty lighty things. The stat upgrading is nice, I wonder how long it will take to finish.
 
Posted by Ricky 12th December, 2010

I just can't get myself to pay for something like this, not when there are so many good free games around.
 
Posted by Ricky 12th December, 2010

Here's an example of some better games that are free:
Chalk: http://create-games.com/download.asp?id=6736
Bonesaw: http://create-games.com/download.asp?id=7040
The underside: http://create-games.com/download.asp?id=7015
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

Where did I say you studied Animation? I used it as an example for myself. It's quite clear, if you actually bother to even read what I said.

And quit the pathetic attempt at acusing me of trolling. You made the first move (and really didn't expect a response?), despite the fact that a couple of months ago in a thread you said you wanted our arguing to end.
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

Once again, you've misunderstood why I provided the example of my degree. I was pointing out that anyone can have a degree, it doesn't make them particularly good at the subject or mean they're an expert.

And that was focused around you and your attitude towards your game, not Big Sky (seeming as you've turned this about yourself). So yes, be a little hypocrit, twist my words all you like (or misunderstand them, like you do so conveniently)

And quit your excuses for attacking me. If you're going to try and act so righteous, perhaps remember that being mature involves ignoring this so called 'very nonconstructive criticism' that motivates you so much to make such idiotic and aggressive comments.
 
Posted by Dave C 12th December, 2010

i'm with Adam... it looks like a bunch of fancy effects and nothing else. But worse than that, these effects look like they will hinder the gameplay, I hate fast paced/bullet games where it's hard to see what is going to kill you and what is just a pointless particle effect.

also Adams games are more fun than Silverfires. lol.
 
Posted by Silveraura 12th December, 2010

Adam, you're absolutely pathetic. That's all I'm going to say. You pull shit out of thin air and make them sound pretty but you're all talk and no substance. Just shut up and walk away. You can't even maturely accept an apology, I'm done with you and your shit. You really need to get a life if your pride is so hurt at the simple flick of a wrist toward anything you do on this site that you need to get all up and arms and start a big fight over it.
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

Adam
"haha another video? No demo again?

"Im not paying £1 for a bunch of ink effect/pixel shader particles and a somewhat basic looking space shooter."

Edit: Why wouldn't this be a MMF2 game?"

Legit comments, judged by what I could see in the video. I can't tell how the gameplay is, I can't tell much at all, appart from the fact that it's filled to the brim with particle effects, hence my comment.

Brandon
"Looks pretty decent. Adam's jealousy brings me giggles."

'Looks decent' followed by a bitchy swipe to trigger fiery Adam, let's make him look bad.

People are capable of reading the comments for themselves, Brandon.

 
Posted by Silveraura 12th December, 2010

I have a temporary demo which I keep on my flash drive to get feedback from folks, but I'm not prepared to upload it to the internet quite yet because it's not anywhere near a position I'm comfortable presenting.

As far as gameplay goes, throughout the time of working on the game, I've gone back and rebuilt and perfected a lot of parts of the game as a whole, including the engine. I know none of this is foreseeable without a demo, but all my work on the game at this point is all in due part to constructive feedback.

Btw, I'm not going to spam up this news page so I'm deleting all but my last comment and this one.

I'm not going to continue fighting with Adam in of all places, a news post.

By the way, Adam. Whether you want to look at it as an excuse or not... you are extremely narrow minded. So when all you can provide is nothing but a thoughtless 'Meh!' to someone else's work, I feel the need to say something - just like you felt the need to haze me for how many years for frankly... well, I still can't justify it. And you're talking down to me about maturity? lol

Anyway, like I said. I'm done. Say what you want. You're not responding to me anymore, you're just planning what you're going to say next after you respond to me, assuming I'll respond back.
Comment edited by SiLVERFIRE on 12/12/2010
 
Posted by OMC 12th December, 2010


 
Posted by nim 12th December, 2010

"Btw, I'm not going to spam up this news page...

I'm not going to continue fighting with Adam in of all places, a news post.

By the way, Adam ... you are extremely narrow minded"

*facepalm*

If you don't want to continue an argument, don't give the other person something to respond to and then declare the argument over. I suppose you just wanted to get the last word.
 
Posted by nim 12th December, 2010

Well, this game looks like a freeware game with HWA and a price tag. Without HWA I doubt there's much game here to sell. And to be absolutely honest, I was of the same opinion about Lunnye and Wake.
<br />

<br />
I know that £1 is "almost free" but why even bother pulling out my credit card when I could download anything by cactus or Hydorah for free? I'd love it if we could sell our games for £1 min., but unfortunately that's not the standard - and so we have freeware games. If this game is worth £1 then Hatman is worth £50 and I should probably be indebted to Konjak, Nifflas and Pixel for the rest of my life.
Comment edited by nim on 12/12/2010
 
Posted by Liquixcat 12th December, 2010

Seriously James, this doesn't belong in the caliber of $1 (1 pound but hell if I know how to do the whacky symbol). At the very most this is a technical demo and you did it in your spare time of *not* working on Tormishire.

Is ths website becoming an advertisement for piss-poor games that cost money, I can find thousands of free games that are thousand times more entertaining.

The sad thing is this is coming from someone who actually likes James. I hope the rest of you avoid this trend!!

P.S. Brandon and Adam (nuff said)
 
Posted by Ricky 12th December, 2010

I just copy and paste £ from other people's posts
 
Posted by OMC 12th December, 2010

<3 Character map.
 
Posted by Xhunterko 12th December, 2010

I for one vote for the closure on all comments any time James releases a new game. As rare as it is, this happens every time. Guranteed. So it's best to just lock comments until tormshire comes out in another 10 years. Sheesh people.
 
Posted by Ricky 12th December, 2010

I remember Shroomlock would use his games to promote charities. He would make really good games for free (flan rising) and on his website and also match your donations
 
Posted by Rikus 12th December, 2010

I like the donation idea, if you like a game you the player can decide how much it is worth.
Comment edited by Rikus on 12/12/2010
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

Can't really do that without a demo, though.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 12th December, 2010

I agree with Nim, Brandons posts are kinda silly. "Any response to this is obviously trolling!"

@Ricky: Shroomlock was a good guy whatever happened to him?

Plus if we want to play education top trumps, I have two degrees and I am about 8 months away from getting my doctorate. Still I know next to bugger all in this field!
 
Posted by Hayo 12th December, 2010

This exploded, TDC-style. And it seems to miss some Brandon posts.
 
Posted by Hayo 12th December, 2010

How do I buy this?
 
Posted by chrilley 12th December, 2010

I think the graphics is a little disappointing. I'd like to see less particle effects and more pixel-artwork like in Tormishire.

I can't say much for gameplay since I haven't played it. A demo is a good idea.
 
Posted by Marko 12th December, 2010

I agree with EVERYONE on here - i love the look of this game! I have this thing where i love playing good looking shoot-em-ups...
 
Posted by Rikus 12th December, 2010

Umm on Hayo's note.. there is no way to buy this! It just says: "Big Sky will be out soon. 1 day ago" .... ?
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

If you do your research- He sold it to a pirate yesterday, who distributed it.

On another note, why release the trailer and game on the same day? Surely it's common sense to release a trailer at least a week in advance to create a reasonable demand for the game...
 
Posted by Rikus 12th December, 2010

I hate that Snarly/Sarcastic "If you do your research" Is there a way you can turn that off Adam? I really dislike that about your comments, there is always something nasty in your otherwise well informed comments. "He sold it to a pirate yesterday, who distributed it." Was all the information I really needed, and I would not feel bad asking it in the first place.

From a consumer standpoint there should be a note why people cant buy it right now. And anyone who is selling a game is going to sell it to a pirate sooner or later, no reason to take the game down for people who actually want to buy it.
 
Posted by Hayo 12th December, 2010

I would LOVE it if pirates came stealing my game. Would mean the thing is worth a damn.
 
Posted by Ski 12th December, 2010

If you read my pms from a couple of weeks ago Rikus, you shouldn't be too surprised.
 
Posted by Rikus 12th December, 2010

Still surprised since I asked a normal question, and I get a snarly comment in a reply back. So you can pat yourself on the back because you both answered my question and made me feel like a idiot at the same time and that is what you like to do, so well done sir.
 
Posted by Rhys D 13th December, 2010

ah, tdc.
 
Posted by UrbanMonk 13th December, 2010

I love this place!

I love Brandon and Adam too, where would this place be without them?

This reminds me a poem,
by our very own hagar:

Some come here to sit and think
Some come here to cause a stink
All I know is that its called the Daily Click
Here I Sit, broken hearted,
spent a click and all I got was an active object
 
Posted by Liquixcat 13th December, 2010

Adam can only effect who wants to be effected. If you felt stupid than it's kind of your own fault for giving a shit, you all should know better. Except Brandon... who always fights with Adam, and has for years...it's cute really...
 
Posted by Marko 13th December, 2010

I find the James-bashing ridiculous - anyone would think he makes games based on paedaphilia the way some people attack him on here. I think the guy is typical of most experienced klikers that are also obviously passionate about computer games: he makes good looking games using genres he enjoys, from what i can see. And like most klikers, he doesn't have unlimited time to work on his very ambitious titles; Anyone would think he's the only person not to finish the games he's making...

...yet some people talk about him like he's a paedo Trip Hawkins (3DO) or something!
 
Posted by Ski 13th December, 2010

The best example you could think of is paedaphilia?
 
Posted by Liquixcat 13th December, 2010

I'm not bashing James, I'm pointing out how this is not worth money. Don't care who made it.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 13th December, 2010

I'm with Liquixcat , its not James bashing - I would say the same to anyone.
 
Posted by The Chris Street 13th December, 2010

Just visited James blog. Adam is indeed correct about the piracy issue:

"Update: itís no longer out. Pirates mean we canít have nice things so BB games will only be available from distributors from here on. Big Sky should be available next week."
 
Posted by Phredreeke 13th December, 2010

So basically, the only way to play Big Sky now (unless you already bought it) is to pirate it. Good move, James.
 
Posted by The Chris Street 13th December, 2010

It'll be out soon via official distributors. In the meantime, I've updated the news post to reflect on this turn of events
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 13th December, 2010

I still think a demo is needed...
 
Posted by Hayo 13th December, 2010

I think James is the Robbie Robertson of click, not Trip Hawkins.
 
Posted by Silveraura 13th December, 2010

For a website that submits kind of poor quality games on average, we sure are pretty spoiled minded.
While I do admit, the game does look like an explosion of mere pixel shaders and special effects, most people would look at this and be willing to pay a buck for it.
Nope, not us. We sit here and bitch about how we don't want to open our wallets for it.
Yes, it could be more then what it is, and a demo is very much needed... but all things considered... we need an explosion of introduction of real world if we don't understand that even stuff of extremely poor quality is somehow sold successfully for a price. We're too used to getting everything free here that even the crappy "free" stuff gets smack for being bad. God forbid anyone try to sell anything, even if it's for a dollar. *sigh*
Sorry if this offends anyone, just speaking my mind.
 
Posted by Dave C 13th December, 2010

I don't know about anyone else... but I get a 'foreign transaction' fee whenever I use my credit card to pay in Pounds/USD, sometimes it's like $5-10. I wonder how much i'd get charged to buy this game for 1 pound (not that i would).
 
Posted by Ricky 13th December, 2010

In my eyes when you price something, you rank it. So i think it's a bit audacious to charge a dollar for this because to me, James is saying he think his game is better than Knytt Stories, eternal daughter, chalk, Legacy of Flan, etc....
 
Posted by Silveraura 14th December, 2010

I'm sorry but I'm going to be honest here. If you honestly think that ranking your product is the only motivation in selling it, then you have no idea how the market works. I don't even have a full grasp on how the market works, to say James sells his game for a dollar, he must think it's better then any game cheaper then his, is pretty offensive.

Which leads me back to how damn spoiled everyone here is. We have a community full of people who design games because they love to do it, not because of profit. So when we have good games that come through being distributed for free, we still feel the need to judge them... which is perfectly fine as long as it's constructive. Then we have people who come in who want to make a couple bucks off of their work and we completely bash them for it.

Seriously, does anyone here have any appreciation for economy? Just because one man has the heart to give away his work for free, does not mean every other man who decides to make some sort of money for ANY sort of work he does, is immediately cold hearted or judgmental of other peoples free works. Damn you guys are spoiled. It's a freaken dollar. Don't buy it if you can afford it, don't buy it if you don't think it's worth it, but stop trying to justify your excuse for not wanting to buy it. I could understand if it was 5 or even 10 dollars, but it's a freaken dollar. Ignore it or shut up. You guys act like you're being force fed and expected to pay for the honor.
If you guys are that careful with your money, then I don't want to see a single person here walking out of a Dunkin Donuts or any sort of shop with a cup of coffee more than twice or three times a week, because once you're done with that, it's gone and you're out however much you paid for it. Something you could've easily gone without. At least when you buy this game, you're supporting someone trying to make some money off of his hard work.
Comment edited by SiLVERFIRE on 12/14/2010
 
Posted by Rikus 14th December, 2010

But in this case it's buying a new donut you have never tried before and you are not allowed a free sample.
 
Posted by Silveraura 14th December, 2010

I understand where you're coming from with that, but even a donut is cheaper then this game and still lasts less than a fraction of the time you'd be spending playing this game, to even decide whether or not you like it. And even at that, I've never been offered a free sample for a new donut. Anytime I've ever tried something new, for THAT cheap... I've never even once considered possibly asking for a free sample. I mean how cheap do you have to be to look in your wallet and see two quarters and say "Well... this could go towards 1/3 of a Mountain Dew, so perhaps spending it on a new donut I may or may not like is too risky for today. Yup, not for me." *walks away*
Coming from someone who used to buy games before demos were mainstream and reviews were abundant, I still stick to my guns and say that everyone here is spoiled if a dollar is too much to spend for a game that clearly had at the very least, flashy presentation taken into consideration.
It's not like this was thrown together in a few minutes in some sort of ingenious attempt to make money. A: It simply looks too good to just be thrown together, despite how simple it looks. It could look far worse. B: No one's going to make a fortune off of a dollar by selling anything they made to.. of all places, the klik community. Especially after considering everything I've just said.
Comment edited by SiLVERFIRE on 12/14/2010
 
Posted by Phredreeke 14th December, 2010

I wouldn't buy this because I wouldn't want to fuel the author's ego.
 
Posted by Rikus 14th December, 2010

The big thing for me is I would have to use my credit card or worse paypal for a low value. I prefer steam or itunes to buy small amounds on.
 
Posted by Silveraura 14th December, 2010

Now see, that's the most legitimate reason I've heard throughout this whole post.
 
Posted by OMC 14th December, 2010

Mention James in a news post and BAM. Hottest spot in town.
 
Posted by Liquixcat 14th December, 2010

There has been several legitimate reasons and one incredibly opinionated Brandon. Stop ignoring the fact that this game is not worth money. If that's the case than a large portion of the games you've enjoyed on this website should have cost you money cause they were in many areas superior than "PIXEL SHADER THE GAME".

To me this community (for the most part) thrives on simple, cute and free games. Most of them are technical demo's of the author's imagination and how far he can take it. With that new knowledge they can build on their games, craft their abilities and create things that actually are worth my time to play. There is more to this than charging money and you bringing in marketing experience was a piss-poor excuse to say the least.

I know James rather well, infact ironically enough I gave him the idea to not outsource Tormishire and to sell it on his own which I'm sure gamesare is not happy about. And James also knows all to well I don't agree with everything he does and I certainly don't want to feed his ego.

So if you want to buy this game Brandon, go for it, let it be known to all the others that this is how it's going to be. I'm not going to encourage it and my reasons are perfectly valid so don't accuse anyone of having anything negative to say that they aren't in their rights to say it.
 
Posted by Blue66 14th December, 2010

Seriously I have seen Lunye and Wake on YouTube and those games are made with little to no effort and just to make a quick buck. This is exactly the same. Little to no effort and throw it out there to make a few quick bucks. I would REALLY REALLY like to know if anyone has ever made a reasonable profit this way. For me this seems like a waste of time and space for everyone, but James keeps throwing this stuff out, so maybe he is smarter than me.
Comment edited by Blue66 on 12/14/2010
 
Posted by s-m-r 14th December, 2010

Haters gonna hate.

If the music market (which also has a glut of free, downloadable content) can nickel & dime consumers for songs at 79 cents each or whatever, then indie developers can nickel and dime game players like us for 1 dollar/pound/euro a game.

I think the question here is how to distribute it. If an "iTunes for indie games" is developed (and steam has come the closest to that, at least for PC), this game and others like it will succeed in bringing in some money. If he had a marketing budget, this game would have gone over better.

And to respond to Blue66: not to legitimize it (as I've not even played it), but there are plenty of people making a living by "making a quick buck" here and there. It very well may be the strategy he's going with. Who knows?
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 14th December, 2010

I agree with Liquixcat (entirely, well said squire!) and Blue66.

Brandon other opinions than your own maybe valid dude . All due to respect to James for creating a game (something I have not done for years) but there is better free alternatives (and far better click games) from the looks of it about. If that's not a legitimate reason, I don't know what is!
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/14/2010
 
Posted by markno2 14th December, 2010

He removed the link to buy the game, so now the only way to get it is by downloading it illegally? That's the best damn tactic of dealing with piracy I've ever heard of.
 
Posted by Dave C 14th December, 2010

haha exactly what I thought marky.

he handled this in the worst possible way imaginable... release a game with no preview hype and no demo and then take it down before anyone but a pirate has a chance to buy it...

if you want to make quick buck games.. i think getting a flash sponsor is the way to go... or if you want to make it big, i think you have to make a awesome game like cave story / lamulana and release it for free, then create a pay version or sequal when its popular and has lots of fanboys...
 
Posted by Yami 15th December, 2010

"This game should be free, because I'm a piece of shit."
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 15th December, 2010

Half of you are stupid. How would an independent expect to make money if no one lets him sell his game? Regardless if you think it's not worth a dollar or not is just a stupid argument.

Look at XNA, there are hundreds of worthless games that are being sold and ironically some of them are making decent money. It's not quit your job and live like kings money, but it's something. But the idea of being able to make a bit of money off of your hobby is very appealing, which is probably one of the reasons why XNA has a huge following in the few years it's been out vs. click products which have been around for a while and could only be considered to have a dainty cult following.

More click users should be selling their games, regardless if they are good or not. If this community really supports clickteam, that is the best thing you can do, not to mention attracting more potential donations to TDC.

I think most of you guys don't sell your games because you don't think anyone will buy it, and judging by the reaction that people seem to give here when you try to sell a game is just ridiculous, and it really is very unfair to anyone who works hard to produce a game independently. Not everyone can make Grand Theft Auto IV on their own, so why would you stop them from making money off of their Feeding Frenzy? If you want to make click games as a freeware hobby or for your portfolio, that's fine, do that, but you shouldn't discourage the others that aren't doing it for the same reason.

And if you want to complain about this guy selling this for a dollar, just remember that Mat Dickie wanted you to buy his garbage for 10 bucks a peice and made a killing (while complaining it was waste of time), and now he's selling his crappy books on subjects he doesn't understand (i.e. Game Design and Atheism) for 15 bucks a pop. That is an outrage, go protest him, not the guys selling simple crap for a dollar. Just remember, he could've sold it for 20 dollars.
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 15th December, 2010

"Seriously I have seen Lunye and Wake on YouTube and those games are made with little to no effort and just to make a quick buck. This is exactly the same. Little to no effort and throw it out there to make a few quick bucks. I would REALLY REALLY like to know if anyone has ever made a reasonable profit this way. For me this seems like a waste of time and space for everyone, but James keeps throwing this stuff out, so maybe he is smarter than me."

Yes, I have. Sniper Defense took me a week and I made over $2,000. You make crap that other people want for the money, and the what ever you like for yourself. Eventually in that system you'll get across a product that will do both, but there should never be anything wrong with doing something to make a little extra money.

By the way, simple games do not equal little effort. For example, Sniper Defense took me a week, but it was a really rough week. We cut a lot of corners, but even that doesn't cut out all of the work.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 15th December, 2010

Nice shit stirring Yami.

@all:
I dont mind people earning money from games, if you like James game or whoever's, go ahead and buy it .

I just the miss the days of clicking for FUN with your community and real life friends.
 
Posted by The Chris Street 15th December, 2010

I don't think it's fair to attack James over his decision to sell his games. He's not forcing you to buy them

I purchased Wake and it's actually pretty fun. I haven't played Lunye yet, though it has been downloaded.
 
Posted by Ski 15th December, 2010

Wow, you managed to play Wake with the ridiculous blur shaders and complete darkness in places? I honestly found the demo unplayable.

As more of an art guy I find plastering shaders all over objects and particles in such ways (ugly ways) an excuse, like 80% of the art exhibitions at the tate modern, churned out by people who are better with words than art.

I guess this is why people on here are annoyed, because they could do it too and most of them don't even consider themselves to be amazing artists like James does.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 15th December, 2010

@ Circy: I fail to see where I have attacked James personally, I have reminisced about the old days and gave my opinion.

Saying this game is not my cup of tea (judging from the video) is not attacking the man. It's like that in higher level academia, people give their opinions on your work (some may try to pull it apart!) but you never attack the person.

Its called peer review, and help improves the quality of everyones work.
 
Posted by Matt Boothman 15th December, 2010

On sale now. Price?

(Wait for it...)

£4.99!

http://www.gamersgate.co.uk/DD-BIGSKY/big-sky
 
Posted by Phredreeke 15th December, 2010

Well, there's a big difference between XNA and Klik. XNA has the Xbox brand behind it, while Klik is pretty much unknown to anyone who hasn't made games with it. Also, with few exceptions Xbox 360 games have always been paid-for, while Klik games have almost always been free.
 
Posted by Phredreeke 15th December, 2010

Also, I'd like to hijack this newspost to inform about http://www.humblebundle.com/ Buy 5 games, you choose the price and who receives the money (between the developers, child's play, EFF and the website operator)
 
Posted by CsaR 15th December, 2010

I agree fully with HorrendousGames.

I can't believe people are complaining about him selling it. I'd be okay with you saying that you don't like it or you won't buy it but complaining that he is selling it is just uncalled for.
I will decide for my own what I THINK of the game. Trying to persuade people that the game isn't sellable is wrong no matter how you look at it. Leave your opinion if you want to and then leave it at that.

Do you guys own a smartphone? Lots of apps there are just plain bad but still makes lots of money. A guy here in Sweden made a soundboard of a clip that became famous here in Sweden and earned like $7,000 on it and I swear I could do the same app in 2-3 hours. Quality has nothing to do with if something is sellable. For god's sake people can sell a service that they buy from another company and then just take more cash for and sell the exact same thing and some of you are complaining about this?
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 15th December, 2010

@CsaR : Letís throw away freedom of speech then, as giving an opinion always has the slim chance of persuading people. Everyone has the right to state their opinion, at the end of the day its still their choice.
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/15/2010
 
Posted by markno2 15th December, 2010

I think we should ban or at least boycott people selling indie games. Shoving ads into games should also be banned.
 
Posted by Silveraura 15th December, 2010

Right, so now everyones finally agreeing with me because HorrendousGames said it.

Well whatever, as long as my view is being seen I don't care who people listened to, to get it. Fact is, I still stand to say that we're so spoiled if we're going to sit here and refuse to buy a game just because everyone here decides to give their games away for free.

And nice attack on Yami's one and only contribution to the news thread, Hagar.

Fact of the matter is, when everyone here started flipping sugar over the fact that someone decided to sell their game for a dollar... it proved more than anything else, how extremely ignorant everyone here is of the real industry. You all act like a bunch of self-proclaimed experts in the gaming industry when you're really just extremely sheltered and stuck in the past. Face it, indie gamers are taken a lot more serious now, and with that comes the ability to sell games. You're not going to get everything you want for free anymore!

CsaR made an AMAZING point. Obviously no one here owns a smartphone. There are hundreds of thousands of shitty games out there, making a ton of money off of selling it for $1-3 and are very successful as a result.

Face it, the day indie gaming was taken seriously by the real world... was the day you all turned your shoulders and tried to preserve the freedom of creativity and the joy as full motivation in game design... and that's awesome, that's great, I fully respect that... but do not start attacking everyone who decides to try to sell something. Just move on. If no one here cares, they'll move on too.

Live in the past if you want, but stop attacking the future. You're worse then a bunch of rednecks firing off a shotgun at any passerby using a cellphone.
Comment edited by SiLVERFIRE on 12/15/2010
 
Posted by Ski 15th December, 2010

"And nice attack on Yami's one and only contribution to the news thread, Hagar."

How was Yami's one and only contribution any use to the news thread anyway?


 
Posted by Silveraura 15th December, 2010

I don't know. Look at your post history. You seem to think a lot of your similar posts are somehow contributive in other threads.
 
Posted by Ski 15th December, 2010

That's right Brandon, be a little bitch about it instead of answering a reasonable question.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 15th December, 2010

Why is everyone getting so uptight?

I guess in your books Brandon calling people pieces of shit for not wanting to buy the game is perfectly acceptable - plus it was kind of a play on words but that obviously went over some peoples heads (shit stirring shit), it mildly amused me anyway.

I am not going to buy this game, because firstly I'm not too keen on space shoot em ups, secondly if I do have the urge to play such a game I would play Xenon II seeing as I own it and brought it for the Sega Master System years ago, and thirdly I will only buy a game (regardless of price) after playing a demo or a copy at a friendís. I have my right to that opinion whether you like it or not.

Also I fail to see how criticising the game video footage is attacking the way of the modern world. I do prefer the old days of clicking purely because I had more fun. I have no problem with James or whoever for trying to sell their games, and I guess some people will buy this at a five pounds (about 8 Ė 9 dollars) but my review standards will be harder regardless of who or what company made it.

On a final note, I own a smartphone but I donít play games on it. I have numerous hand held games consoles with decent control interfaces. If people stop trying to point faults out in my thinking (which maybe old fashioned, but I am entitled to my thoughts), I will stop posting and move on. But people keep trying to have a little jab.
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/15/2010
 
Posted by OMC 15th December, 2010

This got way more complicated and grouchy than it should have.
 
Posted by Strife 15th December, 2010

Is it possible to lock news topics from further commenting? This topic maaaay have gone past its expiration date.
 
Posted by Ricky 15th December, 2010

That would resolve nothing. Let us be adults and continue having a discussion. It's childish to lock threads, heaven forbid people have opposing opinions!
 
Posted by Silveraura 15th December, 2010

@Adam, not being a little bitch. Just giving you a reasonable answer to "reasonable" question. The sarcasm was free of charge.
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 15th December, 2010

"That would resolve nothing. Let us be adults and continue having a discussion. It's childish to lock threads, heaven forbid people have opposing opinions!"

Thank you! That just gets people even more on edge.

"I guess in your books Brandon calling people pieces of shit for not wanting to buy the game is perfectly acceptable - plus it was kind of a play on words but that obviously went over some peoples heads (shit stirring shit), it mildly amused me anyway."

I think Yami's post was hilarious and really summed up some of the attitudes in this thread.

"Right, so now everyones finally agreeing with me because HorrendousGames said it."

I didn't mean to steal your thunder man. Sometimes people just need to hear it a different way from a different person in order to contemplate their situation. Everyone is correct from their own perspective, just some of us are a little more mature to at least attempt to see things from a different perspective.

"Well, there's a big difference between XNA and Klik. XNA has the Xbox brand behind it, while Klik is pretty much unknown to anyone who hasn't made games with it. Also, with few exceptions Xbox 360 games have always been paid-for, while Klik games have almost always been free."

That is a good point, however Click games are so unknown for a multitude of reasons, and it's always a good thing to allow it to evolve and try different things. What sounds more appealing to you? Spend 2 years on a game and give it away for free or spend 2 years on a game and make a bit of money off of it. This world is riddled with stuff that was at first unknown and then became popular. Besides, it sounds like you're arguing the point of "because click games are unknown no one will buy them." If you've got a good enough game, you can always get a decent publisher behind you, then it wouldn't matter if it's a click game or not. (unless of course you want to port it to a certain system, in which case you can always use the PC funds to hire someone).

"Letís throw away freedom of speech then, as giving an opinion always has the slim chance of persuading people. Everyone has the right to state their opinion, at the end of the day its still their choice."

Absolutely right. But sometimes you need to learn when to step out of the way and pick your fights. Like I said, there are many worse games than this making tons of money. Go yell at Silver Dollar Games, or as I said before, Mat Dickie.

"I think we should ban or at least boycott people selling indie games. Shoving ads into games should also be banned."

That's a terrible standpoint. Perhaps Mommy and Daddy pay for your crap, but most of us need money to live, and what better way to make money than doing something you love?

And finally, if you guys hate simple games being sold, then by all means, make an awesome game and sell it, I think you'd really be surprised on how much you can sell with the right tactics. Like I said before, there are plenty of lower level publishers that will be more than willing to publish your game if it's decent.

This community barely plays the games on here as it is, why is it that everyone has such a hard time with this?
 
Posted by Ricky 15th December, 2010

I thought i might be able to get back the money i spent on Flash with add revenue. I thought wrong
 
Posted by Phredreeke 15th December, 2010

It's not as much him selling the game that gets to me, but his whole attitude
 
Posted by OMC 15th December, 2010

Nobody said it would be locked if it could be locked.

Doesn't change the fact that this got nasty for absolutely no reason. You wanna talk about childish?
 
Posted by Silveraura 15th December, 2010

Well hey, as long as it's being heard, HorrendousGames, that's all I care about at this point. I agree whole heartedly with what you said and I'm glad someone finally said it in a way that got at least a handful of people to understand it. So again, more power to you. Thank you.

Also, on the note of freedom of speech.
You have the freedom to speak your opinion. I have the freedom to tell you how I feel about your opinion, and you have the right to get mad at me. And then I have the freedom to say, "cool story bro" and walk away. Because by the end of all that, at the very least, even neither of us got what the other was saying, people around who either heard or read it, could form their own opinions which is exactly what happened here.
Comment edited by SiLVERFIRE on 12/15/2010
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 15th December, 2010

"It's not as much him selling the game that gets to me, but his whole attitude"

Well, I have no opinion about that since I don't know the guy, or what exactly it is about his attitude that sets you off, so you may very well be right.

"Doesn't change the fact that this got nasty for absolutely no reason. You wanna talk about childish?"

Just because some people are being nasty doesn't mean the rest of us are. I think the locking thing was more towards strife's post, more than anything.

"Well hey, as long as it's being heard, HorrendousGames, that's all I care about at this point. I agree whole heartedly with what you said and I'm glad someone finally said it in a way that got at least a handful of people to understand it. So again, more power to you. Thank you."

You're welcome.
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 16th December, 2010

Wannabe diva? That's ironic comming from you.
 
Posted by Ricky 16th December, 2010

Actually, reading the "Taxes" thread made me understand where you were coming from back then, and i feel bad about how it was handled.
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 16th December, 2010

I know, it was all just a bunch of heated arguments. I really have nothing against any of you, I was just frustrated. I am truly sorry for how I acted.
 
Posted by Ricky 16th December, 2010

It's all in the past now
 
Posted by Ski 16th December, 2010

But apparently that doesn't mean you're not holding a grudge, Ricky.
 
Posted by Ricky 16th December, 2010

o_O
 
Posted by Yami 16th December, 2010

I always thought he was holding a slice of pizza.
 
Posted by Ricky 16th December, 2010

No that's actually a rib.
 
Posted by HorrendousGames 16th December, 2010

PhizzyPhan69
"So basically, the only way to play Big Sky now (unless you already bought it) is to pirate it. Good move, James."

marky_2
"He removed the link to buy the game, so now the only way to get it is by downloading it illegally? That's the best damn tactic of dealing with piracy I've ever heard of."

That's the best damn tactic of stealing a joke I've ever heard of. Who are you, Dennis Leary?
 
Posted by UrbanMonk 16th December, 2010

Wake was his best game actually.
I had fun with that one.

I still have it if anyone wants to torrent it.
 
Posted by Liquixcat 16th December, 2010

So it's $5 (5 pounds) now? Just take what I said, pretend it was 5 times longer and 5 times more anti-profit.

As for that guy changing my opinion, I think not. But if Apple wants to sell this game for $5 than I'm fine with that..... oops.... Did I say Apple, I meant James.

Heh, where did that come from?

Does James not come to this site anymore.... Or is he avoiding this topic?

Last thing: I wonder how much he'll charge for Big Sky DSI XL Deluxe Ultimate Edition Director's cut... hmmm
 
Posted by CsaR 16th December, 2010

@..::hagar::.. : Well I think you misunderstod me a bit. I said people are welcome to leave their opionion. The problem is when they put it in a way that just because people don't think like they do they are wrong. That's not how you state your opinion in a friendly way, that's how extremists do it. Also some people lack manners. Things can still be phrased in a nice manner.

I'm not calling anyone an extremist but even you have to agree that there is a seriously bad tone about how people are commenting on him selling the game. I mean the dude is only selling a game....

Also some people here seems to have personal problems with the guy. Well I can understand you not purchasing for that reason but that doesn't really affect any other people than you.

To you guys picking on the author, that makes your opinions more irrelavant to me since I bet that even if he could make the next Knytt(or any other game you find good) you would still say it sucks.
Comment edited by CsaR on 12/16/2010
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 16th December, 2010

@CsaR: I thought I had been very reasonable. I never had a problem with James, he had a good taste in cars (British Leyland ). Also your problem can also be applied to people the other side of the argument fence, as some people on the other side have been rude.

I am a very straight talking person in real life, some people like it some people get upset.

@HG: If those guys come on here I would moan at them too .

On a final note I think this is the most hypocritical thread from all of us, it maybe an great or awful game but I am guessing none of us have played the game!
 
Posted by Phredreeke 16th December, 2010

Well, I have no opinion about that since I don't know the guy, or what exactly it is about his attitude that sets you off, so you may very well be right.

I don't know the guy either, I meant the way he releases the game, someone pirates it, he cries about it and withdraws it, then puts it up for sale again for 5 times the original price.
 
Posted by Ski 16th December, 2010

"Does James not come to this site anymore.... Or is he avoiding this topic?"

He will be through another account or signed out. Do you really think James would miss out on what's being said about him?
 
Posted by Ricky 16th December, 2010

I think silverfire is Dr. Jame's fake account
 
Posted by Fanotherpg 16th December, 2010

It's available now on Gamer's Gate - http://www.gamersgate.co.uk/DD-BIGSKY/big-sky .

And yes I bought it like all other games by Boss Baddie.
 
Posted by Ski 16th December, 2010

Noodle has already posted that.
 
Posted by Phredreeke 16th December, 2010

Correction: Noodle already posted and pointed out the 399% price hike
 
Posted by Fanotherpg 16th December, 2010

I still didn't go through the whole thread of comments. And yeah the price went up probably because of 'company costs'. Still it's fair price.
 
Posted by Fanotherpg 16th December, 2010

I read it through and I have to say that quite lot of you is stating their opinions based on really poor arguments, without basics of knowledge how the market works, which was pointed out by others.

To make it plain and simple... The facts are:
- James made a game
- He put it on sale for £1
- Pirates taken it so he take the plug away
- He put it on Gamer's Gate (they are charging something for sure so the price had to increase)
- New price is £4.99
- He is selling it again

- You are arguing on what right he is selling it (and is it right or not)
- As arguments you are putting free games (where the closest one is Chalk) but...
- None of them looks as good as Big Sky, and none of them gets the market BS is getting
- The decision of making it free or not belongs to author and not you

And because some of you are lacking of constructive arguments:

- You are arguing between yourselves calling each other from bitches and others - what only proves your own level of manners, culture, education, upbringing - call it as you want. And if anyone replies on it, does the same stupidity.

So to sum up, haters will hate, and James will continue doing what he is loving and trying to get back some revenue from it. So where's the point of continuing endless quarrel?

And yes I am on James side, because I'm also doing what I'm loving and I also planning to start getting back some revenue from it. But still I would love to get a demo but I bought the full game.

So answering nim on your questions you are using WSAD and mouse to control it as well in menu SHIFT, CTRL and Enter. The game has got online highscore system and some connection with Facebook and Twitter. Also I would love to see it on Steam and probably I would bought it there second time, not because I've got lots of money but because I like it for what it is. Quite nice shmup with few interesting bits and cool graphics.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 16th December, 2010

As I have stated multiple times, I have no problem with him or his game. I have merely stated what else is out there and my opinion given what I have seen.

You have completely lost most peoples points Fanotherrpg, nobody is trying to control if James or any author sells their game. The point is that people will compare such products against those commercially available, and what else is out in the big world (RCT2 is now £3.50 for example, I know its old but I have the right to decide what I buy). Everyone has different standards at the end of the day, and most people as consumers rather than creators will compare the game against their standards and not what is acceptable in the market. It has nothing to do with education level (I am about 8 months from having the highest level of UK degree and have won numerous scholarships).

Here are my honest thoughts & constructive criticism

+ Great presentation, very professional. The shaders et al all do look cool.
+ Maybe a fun game like R type, but I have yet to play it or a demo.
+ Kind of looks a visualiser for music, which is kinda cool in my opinion.
- Music is a bit repetive and a bit too "club" like for my liking, hopefully there is more music variety in the game
- Majority of the enemies seem to have no AI or even a predetermined path. They seem to just traverse from right to left with a random placing on the y axis. Some do seem to wander up and down in the y axis later on in the video mind.
- In the video, it seems as if you can just spray out weapon fire everywhere. I guess this is later in the game but it just seems a little easy.
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/16/2010
 
Posted by Ski 16th December, 2010

Oh god, Fano's words of wisdom.

"- None of them looks as good as Big Sky, and none of them gets the market BS is getting"

In your opinion.
Comment edited by -Adam- on 12/16/2010
 
Posted by Fanotherpg 16th December, 2010

I'm more oldschool guy so for me Bonesaw and Chalk are more visually interesting than Big Sky, Adam.

But in general (statistical player) Big Sky looks much better thanks to Pixel Shaders and other effects.

Hagar, I'm not questioning your point of view or any other point of view. I just stated in short what feeling reader has got after reading previous 120+ comments, and how it looks from side which is totally not involved.

And thanks for your constructive criticism as well as good luck with getting PhD.
 
Posted by Marko 16th December, 2010

Have to say, i'm interested in Fano's opinion on Big Sky more than anyone elses on this thread as from what i recall he's the only person to have played it!

Any chance of a quick review of how it plays/what the AI is like, etc?
 
Posted by Fanotherpg 16th December, 2010

I can try to make a gameplay footage.

The gameplay is quite interesting.

As a default you are shooting, but you can stop it by pressing Left Mouse Button - it's quite important because shoot spent/shoot scored ratio is quite crucial for score. Each time we lose our score can be sent to database as well as posted on Twitter.

After that we can spent it on upgrades for our ship like shield, improvement of your weapon system and so on. Each upgrade cost more and each of them is slightly different. There is also small achievement system.

But the most interesting part is drilling. Under right mouse button you've got drill which blocks shooting but allows you to survive upcoming meteors or planets or even enemy boss ships. Thanks to it we can drill through them and gain some bonuses.

Also quite interesting stuff is background which is not pixelated and we see our 'allies' fighting with enemy which is quite nice.

As for enemy patterns, each of enemies has got different ability but yeah they're movement is mostly left right up down... So nothing great in this part.
 
Posted by Marko 16th December, 2010

Sounds rather interesting - the use of mouse buttons is unique and defo sounds like it adds something different to the usual 2D shoot-em-up formula. Nice overview, thanks Fano!
 
Posted by Ricky 17th December, 2010

#136
 
Posted by OMC 17th December, 2010

Ha, wondered how long it would take.
 
Posted by Phredreeke 17th December, 2010

#137
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 17th December, 2010

I'm not a number, I am a free man!

Who is number one?
 
Posted by Strife 17th December, 2010

"I'm not a number! I am a man, and I... Oh wait, I'm Number 5. In your FACE, Number 6!" - Homer Simpson

And I do believe the title of #1 belongs to UrbanMonk.
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 17th December, 2010

What you got against MJK hehe - he can not help being number 6 in the village (this thread). The Prisoner intro is made of pure win but I digress....
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/17/2010
 
Posted by Marko 17th December, 2010

Anyone ever been to Portmeirion, the set of the village in The Prisoner? I've been there 3 times!
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 17th December, 2010

I went there when I was very young, I want to go again sometime.
Comment edited by ..::hagar::.. on 12/17/2010
 
Posted by Marko 17th December, 2010

Yeah, me too - the 3 times i went were all with my parents whilst i was still under 14. I think we'd appreciate it more these days now we're older (i would, anyways)
 
Posted by The Chris Street 17th December, 2010

I guess I should change the news post again now. Anyway, I would have probably paid £1.00 to play the game, it's practically nothing, but £4.99? At the moment, without a demo, I'll probably pass

Stupid pirates.
 
Posted by Phredreeke 17th December, 2010

deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerp
 
Posted by ..::hagar::.. 18th December, 2010

@Marko: Yeah I want to go there again, as a kid you never really truely appreciate things like that (well I never did anyway lol)
 
Posted by Muz 23rd December, 2010

Heh, every post about James selling a game reaches 100+ posts. I do agree with what some people say, it looks boring, it looks shiny, but too expensive for a game without a demo. Still, I like James and hope he does well with it.
 


 



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