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Talking Topic #13
News posted 18th April, 2007 by The Chris Street  
What is your best characteristic as a gamemaker?

This is the discussion for this weeks Talking Topic, courtesy of MJK.

What areas of game development do you do well on, and which areas could be improved upon? Additionally, this could also include your personality... do you react badly to critisism, for example, or maybe you are perhaps overly critical, especting perfection? Be honest with yourself!

Please submit your opinions in the comments thread. Remember to keep things clean, and please respect the opinions of other individuals. And, if you have any ideas for the Talking Topic, feel free to mail them to me! Happy debating!

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Posted by Del Duio 18th April, 2007

Probably ideas or graphics. I'm proud of my musical background though. I'm presently working on strengthening my gameplay element, especially for Click games which I'm still technically a n00b at
Posted by Dr. James MD 18th April, 2007

5 or so years in and I still don't know.
Posted by X_Sheep 18th April, 2007

I'm pretty good at game design and programming. I'm bad at designing levels or drawing graphics.
Posted by LIJI 18th April, 2007

I'm pretty the same as X_Sheep.
My opinion on bad criticism that those people are usually just jealous or don't like the genre.
if 20 people would rate a game 80-100 and one person would rate it 30 it wouldn't make so much sense.
Posted by hishnak 18th April, 2007

Definitely strong in the graphic department, horrible when it comes to coding. I've gotten a lot better, but still, my event editor looks like blended spaghetti.

I can tolerate criticism. It's something I just have to swallow and not react to. One thing I can't deal with is criticism when it isn't justified. Like when people crit something
just to make themselves feel better and discredit you.

Posted by DS Strider 18th April, 2007

Me? I'm a perfectionist by default. (If anyone here knows me from anyhow). The only thing I really think I need improvement on is keeping my eye on the project at hand and not getting distracted by everything around me.
Posted by BROO 18th April, 2007

Strong in programming :---), very strong when in building mathematic models :---), but... I specialize in building custom platform movements (haven't already proved, need graphics!!) :---).

Programming (fighting with its bugs?) in TGF :---(.

Criticism? It is still better when someone bother saying anything than silence :---). Anyway - I'm ignoring people about to discredit: yeah, IMO it is very important to have immunity on insults. Why? Check out archived TDC Boards page:
Posted by MJK 18th April, 2007

Perhaps my best area is small game concept design. Also marketing of games, kind of. The biggest problem for me in game making is that I can't draw or animate basically anything so that brings its limits (looking for a graphics artist, wink). Also I rarely have patience or time to commit myself on really big projects, so my games tend to be relatively small.
Posted by Ski 18th April, 2007

Concepts perhaps? hmmm I like to think I can make graphics too
Posted by NeoMonkey 18th April, 2007

I'm good at making graphics if they are not humans what i'm drawing. Also I can code but my bad sides are level designing and not getting any project finished.
Posted by Paul_James 18th April, 2007

i learned today that I suck at everything
Posted by Hayo 18th April, 2007

I am pretty good with graphics and music, not so good with coding and game design. I can stand critisism as long as it helps me get better.

What I totally can't stand is people saying they don't like a game, or even make a post on a frontpage saying they don't like a game. Those people should get a life fast. When I don't like a game I just stfu about it, telling the author about it doesn't help anybody.
Posted by Aptennap 18th April, 2007

I always have the greatest ideas, but when it comes to making the games i never come further then a part of the engine or 1 sprite...
Posted by Hempuli 18th April, 2007

Actually I don't know. I'm pretty good on level design, but I'm not bad on coding, graphics etc. Maybe the worst things on me is that I lose my interest fast, and that I copy ideas ;(
Posted by axel 18th April, 2007

I'm mainly programmer. I've got many years of experience behind me, and I think I know just about everything I need to know to make most kind of 2D games in MMF. I also think I've got a pretty good sense of how to make games, in general, like what you need and how to put it all together so it makes a nice final product.

But I don't know if I can be that objective anyway. You'll have to judge for yourself, next time I release a game.
Posted by Jebin Zedalu 18th April, 2007

I find I'm best at creating story lines and having lots of ideas on what to add to a game. I'm also mildly decent at getting things to work. I enjoy that aspect immensely, in fact.
What I DON'T do well with is graphics and keeping focused. I still haven't truly completed a game in all my years of MMF coding.

As far as criticism goes, I love it. It helps me find the problems of a game. If it is unfounded criticism, I get to retaliate against whoever made the insult. I like trying to make them cry about themselves, too. Extra 5 points, there.
Posted by David Newton (DavidN) 18th April, 2007

In-jokes. Just pile them in and someone's bound to like the game for recognizing at least one of them.
Posted by ben mercer 18th April, 2007

I think I'm pretty good at making graphical effects, programming AI, programming physics and stuff. Also general level design.

But I'm not good at pixel art and I always set the difficulty of my games way too high.
Posted by Ski 18th April, 2007

your physics are ossum
Posted by Johnny Look 18th April, 2007

herr...kliking isn't programming.
Whoever who says "I'm good at programming" is lying, or is just being ignorant.

Posted by axel 18th April, 2007

So now I'm an ignorant liar who doesn't know what programming is? I do "real" programming beside my klik stuff as well, so yes, I know what programming is. And klikking is a form of programming. It's not a programming language, but that doesn't mean it's not programming. And when I say I'm good at programming, then I'm obviously comparing myself to klik standards. So how about you RTFM and STFU now?
Posted by 18th April, 2007

I think the most important characteristic of a game-maker is creativity and patience.
Posted by 18th April, 2007

I misread the question...
I think I do okay on most aspects. Maybe I'd like to compose better music, since the one I do atm sounds much too baroque. I also lack that genious that some people have when coding.
Posted by Johnny Look 18th April, 2007

no that's not programming fool.
You don't need to write a single line of code, mmf all the job for you, all you do is telling him what to do.

Quote from the klikteam site:

"You can get superior and impressive results with no programming skills or knowledge required."
Posted by Johnny Look 18th April, 2007

Posted by Hayo 18th April, 2007

Johnny my boy, you don't know what your are talking about.
Posted by Reno 18th April, 2007

Your still coding. Its just all visual in MMF.
Posted by axel 18th April, 2007

Working off a pre-made engine is still programming, fool.

MMF takes care of graphics routines, keyboard/joystick input, sound and music, compression, etcetera, and gives you an easy-to-use coding interface to use. The rest is up to the user. MMF won't make you a game, it only takes care of the low-level stuff.
Posted by Dr. James MD 18th April, 2007

What about scripting engines and the likes?
Posted by axel 18th April, 2007

I dunno. I'd call it programming as well. It's just another form of programming, just like klikking is a different form of programming. It's not all black-and-white, like C++ is the definition of the word "programming" or something.
Posted by MJK 18th April, 2007

I would relate MMF-programming to something like "macro programming". So, yes, it's a kind of programming, even though MMF itself is not a programming language obviously.
Posted by Johnny Look 18th April, 2007

Yes I do. I'm an actual programmer, I know the diference between using mmf and blitzmax or any other one.

"Computer programming (often shortened to programming or coding) is the process of writing, testing, and maintaining the source code of computer programs." by wikipedia.

You don't need to write a single line of code in mmf.

So who is right you or wikipedia ?

Posted by MasterRaichu 18th April, 2007

I'm mostly an artist (doing more 3D modeling than spriting nowadays), but i also enjoy lots of concept designing.
Posted by zezmoo 18th April, 2007

Im good at ideas... Im good at sprites, Im decent at engines, Im best at music, but I have almost no attention span, so Im crap at finishing what I started.
Posted by axel 18th April, 2007

"So who is right you or wikipedia?"

Neither one of us. Wikipedia is not some sort of almighty, all-knowing god who has the exact definition to all words and terms in existence. If you ask me, programming isn't precisely defined, its meaning can vary. Wikipedia also has a definition for "life", but does that mean that that's the only true, unambiguous definition and meaning of life?
Posted by Peblo 18th April, 2007

Pretty good at complex coding, not so much at the simple stuff because then I lose interest.
Posted by Neuro 18th April, 2007

I'd like to think that my strength lies in the concept and design phase... I rarely have the effort to carry these ideas out, however Graphically, I'm quite skilled, but I lazily look for easier ways to produce graphics. Curse my short attention span.

My coding isn't usually fantastic either, so I tend to design games within my level of ability.

Given a non-lazy team of artists and coders, I could 'make' some damn good stuff, but then who wouldn't think that?
Posted by Reno 18th April, 2007

"So who is right you or wikipedia ? "

wikipedia is made by the people for the people and we are the people so hmmmf *throws a rock*
Posted by Dr. James MD 18th April, 2007

So who is right you or wikipedia ?

Wikipedia is us.
Posted by Dr. James MD 18th April, 2007

Reno won
Posted by Peblo 18th April, 2007

Originality and gameplay.
Posted by The Chris Street 18th April, 2007

Oi, Johnny Look.

Don't ruin this news post please.
Posted by Tim 18th April, 2007

Wikipedia is compiled from peop-oh I win the bronze.

Anyway, me? A sorta all-rounder really, whether that be a good thing or not :\ I mostly code. I'm pretty confident with MMF having used it for so long. Typically, I can't STAND programming. But using this is a diverse approach which doesn't involve sitting and typing out code (which is the side I can't bare, personally) I find it easier to maintain motivation. I'm a visual learner apparently as it is... so that's nice........

I'm also fairly competent composer when provoked () as you may soon discover. I often like to think of funny story lines and or in-game jokes etc. and as for graphics... well I give it a go! Lol. Better at webdesign rather than character design... by a wide margin :\ Though practice makes perfect!

No comparison to the wonders of Adam, Hayo and hishnak. Thanks for reading my article. heh
Posted by Reno 18th April, 2007

What is your best characteristic as a gamemaker?

Posted by Ricky 18th April, 2007

-i'm really bad at graphics and spelling, and music
-i enjoy making egines and the events however
-with that, my goal is to make games that are so fun that people don't care about the graphics
Posted by Reno 18th April, 2007

Thats how NES games were back in a time where graphX wernt possable really :\
Posted by NMasutaa 18th April, 2007

I think I'm best at sprite graphics, artwork, and creative ideas. Not particularly competent in coding, and completely inept at music.
Posted by Superfunk 18th April, 2007

I do a good job at engineering games and do pretty fine at graphics.
I like how I try my best at making most of my games really good. What I don't like is how slowly I do it all and how I end up leaving a game behind sometimes.
Posted by BeamSplashX 18th April, 2007

I think I'm fantastic at designing a game (laying out how it plays and story and modes and such), but otherwise I'm average; I write decent yet repetitive original music, draw graphics are only slightly above just functional, and am lazy about everything else.
Posted by Peblo 19th April, 2007

I'm pretty good at drawing horrendously messy sprites too, I wouldn't count that as my "best characteristic" though.
Posted by DaVince 19th April, 2007

lol, programming = telling the computer what to do, just like programming a DVD recorder means telling the DVD recorder to do something at a certain time. Click products are a kind of programming, discussion over.
Posted by Hayo 19th April, 2007

We should have more DaVinces, everything would be much clearer then
Posted by axel 19th April, 2007

Lol, agreed
Posted by Peblo 19th April, 2007

Oh how silly the community is. Shun the opposition! There's not enough front page room for two different opinions!
Posted by Peblo 19th April, 2007
Posted by chrilley 19th April, 2007

Let's see... I'm not especially good at anything I think. If I must choose then maybe graphics. But it's only slightly better than my crappy programming.

I also never release plain shit games. (That's why you never see me release anything. Uhuhuhuhh...;_; )
Posted by Tim 19th April, 2007

Peblo, that amazing image is truly... amazing.
Posted by Peblo 19th April, 2007

It's the boxart for my next game. I'd say my best characteristic would be boxart.
Posted by DaVince 19th April, 2007

Yay, I should go clone myself.
Posted by Del Duio 19th April, 2007

Whoever who says "I'm good at programming" is lying, or is just being ignorant

Or is also good at programming. I forgot to mention my VB6 skills, thanks!
Posted by Del Duio 19th April, 2007

I think I'm fantastic at designing a game (laying out how it plays and story and modes and such),

Yeah, BeamSplashX has shown me a few of his ideas before and they are pretty creative and good. You need more games to be made out of them though!
Posted by DaVince 19th April, 2007

I'm reasonable at programming, Click and non-Click.
Posted by -Liam- 19th April, 2007

I can doodle... Not much else though.
Posted by Phredreeke 19th April, 2007

*deposits DaVince in box*
*switches box*
Do you want to overwrite saved data?
*selects Yes*
Saving game ple... *turns off game*

*turns on game*
Your save file has been corrupted
Posted by kmhvslj™ (Your Friendly Non-Bot Clicker) 19th April, 2007

I am awful at almost every phase of designing a game - though I am intered in working on my own programs

The absolutely worst (and probably the most important) thing I am lacking are skills in cod..sorry, "event editoring". Neither do I have any animating skills. Maybe the (only) thing I'm good at is creating new ideas (realizing them is a whole another issue, huh).

Posted by axel 19th April, 2007

Phredreeke: That used to happen to me in Pokémon, if I was in a hurry
Posted by Johnny Look 19th April, 2007

ok this discussion is over.
Posted by JFrudy 19th April, 2007

i love drawing sprites and learning how to get better at them.
Posted by DaVince 19th April, 2007

Yay I win

Posted by DaVince 19th April, 2007

"DaVince is a shy Pokémans who usually hangs around computers. He feels a strange need to visit TDC almost daily."

Length: 1.90m
Type: normal, electric
DC Points: 121

Posted by Phredreeke 19th April, 2007

Phredreeke: That used to happen to me in Pokémon, if I was in a hurry

That's the so called cloning trick. It makes you have the pokémon both in the box and on you.
Posted by Hempuli 19th April, 2007

This topic is good because here we can talk about the good things in ourselves.
Posted by AndyUK 19th April, 2007

I like to think i'm at least average at most aspects in game making.

If i had to choose one think i though i was better at i'd say i was slightly better at graphics than most other things.

But improving all the time! Albeit very slowly.
Posted by Hayo 19th April, 2007

The last gfx you showed me were pretty awesome.
Posted by Dr. James MD 19th April, 2007

I think I'm good at stylised graphics. Mostly used because I can't be bothered with dithering and limiting colours.
Just getting into music now, could never do this without a midi keyboard. So instead of "virtual" keyboards I can now apply my piano skills to game making.

um... No I still don't know!
Posted by Zethell 19th April, 2007

Game Design & Level Design are my best areas around game development.

I can do some Code, infact i can solve most things that isnt network/online related.
My pixelart skills CAN be good, at times.


I SUCK at making music or sound effects.
I HATE taking critics for my games, but i do appreciate it.

But, if i give myself some time to make music, like a year or two, i bet i will be average at it :]
Posted by steve 19th April, 2007

Management. I can create and finish a profitable game
Posted by alastair john jack 20th April, 2007

I'm not very good at graphics/coding/designing a game for other people, although I am good at making games that appeal to myself.
Posted by Guillermo (Cc) 20th April, 2007

I'm VERY GOOD at starting projects, but I suck at finishing them no, seriously, I do OK in most areas but I'm not GREAT in any in particular. But, hmmm, I hate animating, it's a frustrating and time consuming chore for me... So I must suck at it.
Posted by viva/volt 20th April, 2007

Programming, i'm ok a graphics and concept but hate level design :\
Posted by Airflow 20th April, 2007

I'm best at making code. The majority of my games are charactorised by scrutiny in code. This reflects in my level design inwhich the gamer needs scrutinous methods to actually get anywhere. I also like drawing. While I take critisisim lightly, I'm not one for openly believing anthing you say. So it's usually best you have some evidence to back up why it "suxors" or makes you "angry". In the case of the later I prefere a video.
Posted by DaVince 20th April, 2007

@Guillermo: you'd only suck at it if the result doesn't look good. If it does look good then you don't suck at it but you just hate doing it.
Posted by Torava 20th April, 2007

I think I'm best at coding. I also draw pretty good graphics, compose tracker-music but I suck at level design and sometimes I give up too easily. I can't show my games here because they have Finnish language.

(sorry my bad english)
Posted by Hayo 20th April, 2007

Your english is fine actually.
Posted by Tim 20th April, 2007

Yeah, good sense make that one
Posted by Ski 20th April, 2007

Posted by AndyUK 20th April, 2007

It's understandable, which on the internet is above a large amount of stuff written.
Posted by waffleton 20th April, 2007

Best characteristics, eh? :0

Hmm... making crappy games? D;
Posted by Tim 20th April, 2007

It's a skill to be truly crap.
Posted by Rikus 20th April, 2007

comment nr 90 For me i would say level design, love to do stuff like that
Posted by JetpackLover 20th April, 2007

I would say right now its Character design, and Graphics, also I have an odd ability of always coming up with ways to make something either look, act, or be presented cooler than I previously imagined.

Posted by Peblo 21st April, 2007

"Hmm... making crappy games? D; "
lol I know how it is.
Posted by Del Duio 21st April, 2007

also I have an odd ability of always coming up with ways to make something either look, act, or be presented cooler than I previously imagined

That's awesome when that happens. By accident, sometimes pieces of my individual stuff inside a game turns out better than I thought they would. And sometimes a LOT better!
Posted by Muz 22nd April, 2007

Wow, late post. I tend to expect too much perfection from myself, so I kinda look down on my skills.

I'm good at coding (in klik, C++, assembly, and most other 'programming' 'languages'). I'm pretty OK with graphics, though I take too long to do animations and bad with perspectives so I don't really bother with it. And very good at concept design (balancing the game, addictive features, difficulty). I think my design for Trap Designer, Combatant, Chaos Wave, and that other RTS would catch on, just that I'm too lazy to work on the basic engine or the script engine.

I do suck badly at design though. I don't know why, it's always some form of design or another. I could design a complex world with it's own economy, history and stuff, filled with lots of interesting characters and levels.. but I'd suck bad at story because I don't want to ruin the world. And if I did a good story, I'd have bad ideas for the level or character design for some reason.
Posted by Tomssuli 26th April, 2007

even later post... don't shoot me for it. I'm good at ideas, troubleshooting, playtesting , "coding", pleasing myself (don't get dirty ideas!)...
Not so good with plot, graphics, finishing games, making games for others.
For the musics and level design, I can't decide whether I'm good or bad.


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