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Microsoft Boku! -Should Clickteam Worry?
News posted 30th October, 2008 by Rikus  
Interesting news today folks, it looks like microsoft is working on its own version of klik&play-2008 for the pc and xbox360! It uses the very familiar klik&play setup of programming objects together. Microsoft is saying: "Boku is a new visual programming language made specifically for creating games. It is designed to be accessible for children and enjoyable for anyone. The programming environment runs on the XBox, allowing rapid design iteration using only a game controller for input."

Have a look at the link below, do you think clickteam should be worried if this project gets bigger or will this never reach the complexity of mmf 2. Share with us what you think!

Posted by Jon Lambert 30th October, 2008

Nah, it's too basic. Once someone gets good enough at it, they'll either want more or get bored. Then they come to us.
Posted by Pixelthief 30th October, 2008

its way too kiddie. no serious applications like MMF

looks a ton like the LEGO programming language, from classes I've taught to kids. Almost exactly so. Wonder if theres plagiarism going on there (it used little chain links of when/do statements like that)

Comment edited by Pixelthief on 10/30/2008
Posted by Dr. James MD 30th October, 2008

Microsoft plagiarise? Certainly not!
Posted by Kisguri 30th October, 2008

Everybody wants to be Clickteam.... (lol)
Posted by OMC 30th October, 2008

Well, if it were complex enough, which it isn't, I'd say Clickteam should sue 'em. But it's definitely not a "new" graphics interface... Just microsoft spewing some crap.
Posted by Del Duio 30th October, 2008

Being able to play your own games on your own console on your own TV is a pretty big draw IMO. This will likely still sell well to people who have zero (or little) prior experience.
Posted by OMC 30th October, 2008

Then they move up to XNA.
Posted by DaVince 30th October, 2008

People, creating an applications that lets you create simple games with a few clicks/button presses certainly isn't Clickteam-licensed technology and has been done plenty of times in the past. <_<
Posted by NeoMonkey 30th October, 2008

There is still possibility, of that program to become like like mmf and it has one advantage, XNA runtimes. So When it comes people forgets mmf and starts doing games into xbox live argade.
Posted by Simon Colmer 30th October, 2008

Yeah i dont think the complexity will ever mount to mmf - esp with the extensions in MMF which i woudlnt think would be useful for games on xbox (with lack of an operating system!)
Its a different market they are attacking......right? lol
Posted by aphant 30th October, 2008

From what I can see, you can't make your own graphics. You have to use premade stuff, or assemble premade stuff to make your own. Both of which, I don't like. And then what about music?
Posted by -Athan- 30th October, 2008

well rikus, what clickteam did is a master piece. even if microsoft is experienced in programming, it won't help! mmf2 is the best outta there...the only thing it needs its to be able to create cool 3D games
Posted by Rikus 30th October, 2008

Well the thing what worries me is this, what if this piece of software gets popular and microsoft starts to put more functions in it and making it more complex, with microsofts resources and money it makes for at least good conversation topic. Image
Comment edited by Rikus on 10/30/2008
Posted by Dr. James MD 30th October, 2008

Personally I think this shows what kind of goldmine Clickteam have been sat on all this time. People love making stuff without knowing coding and since the KnP days we now have Gamemaker, XNA, Boku (Gokuuuuuu) and other little things like it.
They need to flex their creative chest as it were. Get their name out there some more, get their game in shops (I swear I saw TGF or MMF1 in a shop when I was a kid, now it's just online only?).

Come on CT. You're good for it
Also wondering how Clickteam will react to this, and hoping it makes MMF3 a really stellar app.
Comment edited by Dr. James on 10/30/2008
Posted by X_Sheep 30th October, 2008

The problem is that people expect more of creating games. When I tell someone about Multimedia Fusion 2, they immediately compare it to Gamemaker and ask if it can do 3D.

Obviously Gamemaker isn't better because it can do 3D. I still have not seen one good 3D Gamemaker game.
Comment edited by X_Sheep on 10/30/2008
Posted by columbo borgi :C 30th October, 2008

imho, cliclktem should meka a portable runtime. IT IS THE SOLUTION! :C

and this bokuu seems like a toy or somethin like that. i hope it wont get much attention ;>
Posted by UrbanMonk 30th October, 2008

It looks kinda fun actually!
Clickteam doesn't have to worry; it looks like you can only make performer type games with it.
Posted by DS Strider 30th October, 2008

I haven't tried it out myself to be sure, but from the screenshots I've seen Boku or Bogu, whatever it's called, looks like it has a lot less functionality then Clickteam's products. At most, the programmer might be able to make a game along the levels of a Klik n Play title.
Posted by aphant 30th October, 2008

I think that Boku also kills Clickteam's chance in getting some official Xbox portability support from Microsoft. Although, I suppose it's always possible that Clickteam could still "join up" with MS and help make this Boku even better, if not get MMF2 (3?) to be supported as well.

I really just want to be able to play a game like Tormishire from the comfort of my couch using my 360.
Posted by Dr. James MD 30th October, 2008

You might be able to
Posted by Otter 30th October, 2008

Well, I heard Jeff speak of getting swf, flash runtime, in mmf3. If that happens, I wouldn't worry about Xbox compatibility, because Wii can play flash games!
Posted by Carnivorous id 30th October, 2008

I'd like to try the interface because I can't see it being easy to draw or animate with a joystick instead of a mouse. I could see trying it though. I mean think of how many people you could reach as far as downloads.
Posted by -Athan- 30th October, 2008

rikus is right about the microsoft money and all that things. i don't know, but mmf2 created already a lot of community. i don't think people will go for this thing and leave mmf...
Posted by Cecilectomy 30th October, 2008

dr james. why did you include xna in your list of similar click software? its a sdk for c# and the .net framework

what if mmf got support from microsoft and xbox? mmf with c# and xna runtime? clickteam will be king with java, directx, hardware acceleration, flash(?), and xbox support.

eh? Image
Comment edited by cecil on 10/30/2008
Posted by OMC 30th October, 2008

Meh. I'm about as worried about this as I am of Alice taking over. Sure, point-and-click game creation has been done before, but only Clickteam has mastered it, imesnhho. I don't think Clickteam will ever have Xbox compatibility.

What else did I want to say...? >_O Dagnabbit I hate being old.
Posted by Jon C-B 30th October, 2008

It looks good for younger kids that want a less advanced way of making games. If I was younger I wold gt this
Posted by Johnny Look 30th October, 2008

I think clickteam have more reasons to be worried with construct and game maker than this imo.
Looks like a good way for kids to get involved with game creations somehow, but if I'm not mistaken there was a similar tool for pc released not long ago.
Posted by -Liam- 30th October, 2008

I think this looks pretty bad. It reminds me of other applications such as RPG Maker where you just find yourself way too limited. Seems great for making small games quickly but I'd imagine everyone's creations would all have the same sort of feel to them. Is it possible to make your own graphics for this etc?
Posted by Cecilectomy 30th October, 2008

id also just like to point out that...its 3d. as simple as it may be right now, it does have future potential. mmf needs to go 3d.

the information is limited on the linked page. but i think its for pc as well? might be a nice little tool to have fun with, is it free?
Posted by Marko 30th October, 2008

Looks good, but there ain't alot to see. I hope it becomes as good - and eventually better - as MMF2 coz i think competitionis healthy. I am a MMF fan-boy coz it's the best out there (for me), but if something better comes along i will defo jump ship.

Serious competition will push MMF to be even better!
Posted by 3kliksphilip 31st October, 2008

I've wanted a programme out like MMF2 for consoles for a long time. It will help people to become more creative and inventive. Just look at how Garrys Mod has taken off.

I can't rate this as I haven't used it, but it's a step in the right direction. I only wish it had been made 10 years ago. We could have made games capable of competiting against Playstation 1 games in terms of graphics. Now it's a kind of lost cause until somebody makes MMF3D . Come on, that 3's there for a reason!
Posted by NeoMonkey 31st October, 2008

I think microsoft boku is good for clickteam, if we look ourselfs. The competition (as you have said) will take the mmf to next level. Now I don't like the idea, of mmf3 being a 2d, because mmf2 is doing everything needed. When HWA is released, then there is no need of new 2d mmf. Because I can't think about anything, which could be included anymore. And therefore I'm fearing, taht mmf3 is a flop. I have paid um... 150-200€ of mmf1 and 2, so i'm not going to buy 3 is it's 2d. I have 2 and that all I need, exept if HWA is coming into mmf3, then I'm going to boigot clickteam. Also I think clickteam isn't doing good marketing. Now how I found them, just went to google and wrote there: "how to make games no coding". And wolaa knp was found. No advetisments, no commercials. Huoh... I think also their online shop is kinda outdated... But yes, I hope this boku will become more professional and clickteam and MS would start to compete. Quality rises and prises falls. Also I like the idea of Ms buying CT, because they can market and they would push the guys to make new versions in every year.

So Boku RISE!
Posted by Va1entine 31st October, 2008

Great idea, would be nice though if we could play click games on the xbox that would be really cool!
Posted by Va1entine 31st October, 2008

Oh and add achivements!
Posted by Jon Lambert 31st October, 2008

It is 3D, but does anyone know if you can move around in 3D? Also, is it a good movement engine?
Posted by alastair john jack 31st October, 2008

I'm glad there seems to be more game creation software these days, hopefully in a few years there will be too many options to choose from. But if that happens then Clickteam will have to actually improve there products
Posted by Assault Andy 31st October, 2008

This software looks like it might be a bit of fun, and at it's core it really is designed for the average user - hence its simplistic interface and coding. It has limited characters, etc so I'm sure many of the games will look the same. Overall it looks like fun, but it's definitely no MMF.
Posted by Rob Rule 31st October, 2008

I'd say Construct is a much more viable candidate for competition for Clickteam; this thing looks like the Moviemaker of the game making world - simple but limited.
Posted by aphant 31st October, 2008

Hopefully this is the fire that gets us things like global qualifiers and such.
Posted by alastair john jack 31st October, 2008

And HWA.
Posted by Jason Orme 31st October, 2008

Some example videos on YouTube
Posted by Cecilectomy 31st October, 2008

that actually looks quite fun. the only similarities seem to be the characters and that the terrain looks like its built from legos. other than that it looks like a good assortment of 3d games. looks interesting.
Posted by markno2 31st October, 2008

I'm not buying MMF3 (a.k.a K&P 5) if it's only 2D, either.
Posted by -Athan- 31st October, 2008

me either. 3d is the next generation gaming style...
Posted by Marko 31st October, 2008

I agree with the above 2 statements, MMF needs to evolve more from now on. HWA is a good step but i think it should have been done ages ago - 3D is the next proper step.
Posted by Muz 31st October, 2008

Oh, when Microsoft gets its foot into something, you'd better get worried. Remember the crappy IE, which knocked out Netscape? Or MS Word, which bankrupted WordPerfect? Or Windows Media Player, which is competing so fiercely with Real Player and Winamp that they made it illegal at one time to include it with Windows? Also there's Windows (3.1) itself, the XBox, the improved new search engine. I'm hoping they'll buy out Clickteam and make MMF even better

Clickteam was sitting on a fricking diamond mine and they treated it the same way, with tight controls, and a lot of good, very focused marketing. I just hope they don't start hiring assassins, though I guess that's why guys like LIJI looked like they were doing
Posted by Christodoulou Apps 31st October, 2008

Boku is not so advanced like MMF2.
Posted by surpreme ruler of castlevania.....JRP#3000 31st October, 2008

looks like crap, no way clickteam should be worried.

Posted by Simon Czentnár 31st October, 2008

Clickteam should not be worried. This program could be nice but it is quite an other category!
Posted by columbo borgi :C 31st October, 2008

Posted by NeoMonkey 31st October, 2008

This program has nice 3d stuff and Xbox runtime, so I think clickteam should be worried!
Posted by 3kliksphilip 31st October, 2008

Think of it this way- what made you choose MMF over C+_ and other programming languages? Although more limited, MMF is far faster and produces results in a fraction of a time.

People will compare Baku to MMF in this sort of way. Baku's games look far more professional. 3D certainly helps. Who CARES if it's more limited? Well, people who know MMF will, but newcomers will choose Baku because it seems a lot easier and with more professional results.

Hopefully this will make the Click Team rise above the levels of KnP that they've stayed at for so long. It was a winning formula which they nailed on the head first time. Small improvements (ie, more values, more objects on a level at once) won't stop Baku from dominating the market if it's as easy and professional as it looks.
Posted by Djfuego 31st October, 2008

You are going to be bored stiff with this as it's no where near MMF.
It's limited by the content that you can't provide..
It's interface is controlled with a joypad.
It's aimed at children
Need I say anything else?

Posted by Tropik 31st October, 2008

I think, clickteam should not be worried, becasue clickteam is the best in every thing
Posted by Impresario 31st October, 2008

I am goimg to guess this is in developement because of this= <A HREF=""></A>

Rather than trying to be Clickteam.

Bah I actually read the article and there is a link to scratch already. Scratch has been around for atleast a year.
Comment edited by Impresario on 10/31/2008
Posted by Ando 31st October, 2008

While I like the idea of 3D, I'm not sure that it'd be very easy at all for Clickteam to make a MMF3 or whatever with a 3D engine but still keeping it as simple as it is now. I mean, Jamagic had you learning an entire scripting language. :/

Still, though, regarding this oddly-named Boku... Nahhh. While it will spread more word-of-mouth-wise, if anyone is serious about looking for a good game-making application, they'll do their research and find MMF2.
Posted by 3kliksphilip 31st October, 2008

I never imagined 2D game making to be as easy as it is with TGF / MMF etc. I can't even believe to imagine the number of problems 3D could bring about, but hey- there's definitely a market for it. Some one will take up the challenge if Click Team doesn't. Perhaps Microsoft.

As for it being for children... who says? It's EASY enough for children to make stuff with, but I was a child when I started with KnP. And the PC version of Boku won't be controlled with a joystick. My friend says I can't make music with a mouse and I beg to differ. As for Boku being too simplistic... how do you know that? If it's flexible enough the sky's the limit.
Comment edited by 3kliksphilip on 10/31/2008
Posted by Linkman 31st October, 2008

Clickteam doesn't really have to worry about this since it's probably not going to be free. They need to worry more about free alternatives like Game Maker, Construct, and Stencyl(if it really exists. ).

Clickteam really needs to step up their game if they want people to choose MMF2 over free alternatives.
Posted by aphant 31st October, 2008

But how can they step up their game? Global qualifiers, renameable qualifiers, HWA, and portable runtime all sound feasible, but will that be enough to make MMF2 rise above the free stuff? The biggest things, like 3D or built-in hit boxes for active objects, can all be provided via extensions.
Posted by Codemonkey 31st October, 2008

3d clickteam software should really not happen.
Posted by DaVince 31st October, 2008

"It is 3D, but does anyone know if you can move around in 3D?"
That "move forward" action in the screenshot should tell you enough. Because, you know, in 2D it would be "move left or right".

"looks like crap, no way clickteam should be worried."
Actually, visually speaking, it looks nothing like crap and is visually appealing. Then again, the tool doesn't seem to be aimed to be as powerful as MMF, but just a simple toy to make simple games.
Posted by Ando 31st October, 2008

That "move forward" action in the screenshot should tell you enough. Because, you know, in 2D it would be "move left or right".

Not necessarily. It might just mean "move either left or right, depending on the direction that the object is facing".
Comment edited by Ando on 10/31/2008
Posted by Silveraura 31st October, 2008

How about we look at a variable Clickteam is offering that Microsoft will more then less likely not offer.

Royalty-Free sell for whatever it is that you make (MMF2 Pro) or Logo based royalty for Standard. I highly doubt Microsoft will let this thing release abominations on Xbox Live or make it possible to burn to disk. So I think MMF2 is pretty safe in that aspect.
Posted by Marko 31st October, 2008

It's 3D (more modern and more appealing to new-comers) and it's on both a console and the PC. I think it has potential to take market share, for sure
Posted by Clubsoft 31st October, 2008

Hmm, talking of LEGO software, the first version of that (With RCX1.0) was written in C&C
Posted by Cecilectomy 1st November, 2008

really? the lego mindstorms programming application was written in C&C? thats impressive.
Posted by DaVince 2nd November, 2008

Ando: that just unnecessarily complicates things. "Move forward. Turn around"?
Posted by Rick (AntiMatter Entertainment) 2nd November, 2008

This does look a little too simple to compare with Clickteam's products, but I think it will be successful and it will more than likely lead to more products with more functionality. If this takes off, and I think it might... then Clickteam might have a serious competitor.
Posted by Silveraura 5th November, 2008

3D or no 3D, it's entirely irrelevant if people can't even truly distribute what they worked hard on, royalty free. Until they have that, I don't think it will truly attract anyone who even has the potential for thinking that they could probably take this seriously.


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