I see that my english tends to be worse then it should from time to time, I apologize about that. But that`s just becuse I`m always in a hurry and it`s not my native languish.
It looks like it won't be possible to move all enemies at once - there's no way to stop two or more both moving to the same square. Instead, we'll have to run a fastloop to move them all one at a time. It's inconvenient but it's not a big problem.
Your graphics are looking very nice now, although the perspective isn't consistent - in particular, the trees are viewed from above, but everything else is viewed at an angle. Also, I'm not sure PurPur and the baddies need a box around them - what's it for? A little texture and variety would help too - make a couple of grass tiles with flowers or something, just to break up the areas of solid green.
Been wondering this for a while - why on earth do you play a giant purple cat?!
No need to apologize for your english - it's really very good, and much better than my swedish (infact I don't know any swedish at all). I'm always amazed at how good the rest of the world is at speaking english, and how bad we english people are at learning any other foreign languages - I lived in France for 7 months and I can still only barely speak their language. Out of interest, do you have any idea how widely spoken english is in swedish ski resorts? I've worked seasons in the Alps and Rockies and I'd really like to do a ski season in scandinavia somewhere, but I don't know if the language barrier would be a big problem.
Is it`s still possible to make them move even if purpur don`t, even if they move one at the time?
About the grapics part, ofc it`s not finished yet, the stones, the trees and the texture of the roads should eventually all be replaced. The stones, the grass and the road simply got messed up when I changed from 16million to 256, I kind of expected it though. Also the trees are to small so I´ll probably make them in four pieces so they`ll take up 4 grids when I´ll change them.
I`ll fix the grass later on, first I want to fix the stones and trees.. and the fence too, it`s still in the old perspective.
The boxes around the enemies, purpur and chests were supposed to make it eaiser to see where everything was, I though it would be a great idea becuse in the beginning I thought it would feel kind of "turn based". Maybe I should remove them, you think it would be better without?
Oh, there is a reason why purpur is a giant purple cat. Alot of years ago in the 90's I made a game for my friends using KnP, it was called "Purpur kattens äventyr" which is Swedish but would be translated to "The purpur cats adventure". The purpur cat goes way back though, It was kind of like an "internal joke character" for me and my friends.
I thought it would be fun for my friends if a made a second game, especially since the first one was so horrible in all aspects But this project went from a small random quick creation to a serious project, just look at how the grapic looked in the first uploaded gam. Anyhow, now when it`s come this far I`ve decided to adapt the gameplay so it would fit a bigger audiance. So it will probably be uploaded to DailyClick when it`s finished (I never uploaded any of my games before).
Also, Purpur means Purple is swedish, and as you know a cat can purr when it`s happy, so I guess that´s what it name comes from, the "purpur" cat. And when you think about it, purpur is not so weird if you compare him to kirby (a pink "ball" which sucks people up).. or sonic (a GIANT BLUE HEDGEHOG!).
btw, I`m not familiar with fastloops so it would be great if you added some notes so I could learn something, thanks!
sorry I haven't produced anything lately, but i'm getting rapidly more frustrated with this. Have you considered making it non-grid-based? It might make the movement side of things easier. Or maybe start another thread - see if anyone else can come up with something.
No need to be sorry, you`r helping me out of goodwill anyway
Hm, non grid you say. Reason why I chose grid movment was becuse that was the only self made movement that I know how to do(didn`t know how to make it smoth though). And i really don`t like the "bird perspective" built in movement that comes with tgf/mmf (I don`t remember what it was called). I guess it would be possible to do another type of movement, no doubt. But some ideas might have to be changed in the battle system, no?
It would be hard to know if you`ve entered or left a baddies attack area or not. With grid movement you could easily learn that baddie1 has a one grid attack area so you would just have to back away once. Without grid movement this feat might be a bit trickier, maybe a transparent area(or maybe just the outline) could be viewed while purpur is inside and dissapear when he leaves?
Ofc, if grid movemnt is not used the player would be able to move more freely, hence the attack zones would not be squares any more, more like circles?.. hm, well I don`t know becuse I can`t remember ever seeing a good movement engine for this perspective which isn`t grid based.
If you have any suggestions I`m very open-minded. Any ideas of your own or do you know any good click game with good movement for this type of game?
I feel a little bad about starting another thread right now since the project is kind of a...uh..mess? I usually like to know what I`m supposed to ask people but at this current stage I`m not really sure anymore.. maybe a new movement system would be for the better, maybe not.. I simply don`t know.
Ok, we'll stick with the grid based. I think I've nearly got it anyway... (the movement part, that is)
All this talk of Zelda got me started playing SNES games again. One of these was a game called "Secret of Evermore". Not strictly a zelda clone, but it does have similarities. Anyway, the interesting part was the combat system. It doesn't appear to be grid based, but it does feature weapons that "charge" up and are more effective the more fully charged they are. The bazooka for example, must be fully charged to be fired - if you press fire before then, the character just knocks the baddy over the head with it!
You might want to take a look (rom & snes emulator can be found at rom-world.com).
It's probably not something you'd want to copy, as it's a *lot* of events for just 4-direction movement and block pushing. I just wanted to add a few small details, such as being able to turn on the spot by tapping a direction key.
I may use a normal non-grid based 8-direction movement for the overworld. If there is an overworld - I'm taking it very much one step at a time. I have yet to decide on a combat system, or indeed if there will be any combat.
I`ve downloaded the game and a snes emulator, I´ll need to play for a while before I can write my opinion though. I`ve downloaded you mfa file too, but as usual I`m not home yet so I can`t open it here, I´ll put it on my USB stick for now.
About block pushing.. I`ll probably have to change those events in my game as well. As it is now purpur automatically push everything away then the player hit`s space button. I`m thinking that it might be better if pressing space allows PurPur to "grab" the blocks, then I could make him both push and pull, which would be useful in more complex puzzles. Moving different blocks will be a big part of the games "thinking" so.. it`ll probably have to be done.
Also been playing "Illusion of Gaia". Good game, much more like Zelda. Possibly even better than zelda (that's blasphemy I know).
Another game which I very highly recommend is "Mole Mania" for the gameboy (the best puzzle game ever made imo - made by the same guy as mario, donkey kong, zelda, f-zero etc). You can again get rom and visualboy advance from rom-world.com.
Anyway, that uses an extra button for push/pulling, so the system works like this;
To push object;
* just walk into it.
* this works on every kind of moveable object.
To pull object;
* press arrow key to face block, then hold fire and opposite arrow key to drag it.
* this only works on some types of object - not heavy ones.
To kick object;
* hold fire until animation changes, then press arrow key in direction of object to kick.
* this only works on a few objects (balls, cabbages, barrels etc) - they keep rolling until they hit another object.
To throw object;
* hold fire until animation changes, then press arrow key opposite direction of object to kick.
* this only works on a few objects (balls, cabbages, barrels etc) - they are thrown back over your head, and keep rolling until they hit another object.
The puzzles are incredibly well designed. For example;
* You are forced to tunnel,
* but, this creates a hole where you surface,
* and, this hole stops you moving the ball where you want it (the ball would drop into the hole),
* so, you push a barrel into the hole to block it,
* but, now you can't dig another tunnel any more (you can't tunnel through a buried barrel).
Honestly, it's sheer genius. You *MUST* play it!
Variations on a theme...
"Golden Sun" (another brilliant game) features a lot of logs or log-like objects in it's puzzles. They are basically big blocks, 3 squares long by 1 square wide. They can be rolled from either side, but cannot be pushed from an end. Don't ask me how you'd code it in MMF though - it wouldn't be easy I don't think. Also, if they are pushed into water, you can use them as a kind of bridge.
It also features "psynergies" (magic basically) allowing you to move blocks from a distance of 2 squares away, and to lift blocks so you can stack or walk under them.
It also features a variation on the plumbing type games. Some blocks act as right-angle bent pipes whilst some are plain vertical or horizontal pipes. You have to push them into position, such that they form a continuous pipe between two points. Mole Mania actually also features bent pipes used to redirect rolling balls and cabbages.
If you know of any other puzzle elements that could be added, please feel free to share
I'm thinking of including a kind of sudoku puzzle in my game, where some of the floor tiles have markings corresponding to numbers 1-9. You'll have to solve the puzzle and move each of 9 blocks, so that they are all on a different square with the same number (there will be a sign on the door or something to tell the player which number). I hope nobody else is reading this or I've just given away the solution...
The latest change to my game has made it so the character moves more slowly when pushing objects. It's only a little detail, but it makes a huge difference - all of a sudden, the blocks actually started to *feel* heavy. Could be worth adding?
http://cid-b1e7ee094271bbda.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/Public/006.mfa
The problem with making a lot of changes to the push/pull system is that they need to be integrated into the movement system. You can't change one without having to modify the other. If you want to make changes, that's fine, but make certain you won't be wanting to change it again after.
I'm still *trying* on the AI movement problem, but don't seem to be getting far. I just don't understand why some of the things I've tried haven't worked
If I get totally stuck I'll move onto the combat system instead.
It would probably be better if purpur really "pushed" the blocks instead of just making them push themself. I`ll need some new animations for purpurs push and pull in all 4 directions.. might take me some time since I`m not that good at pixling and I`m still working on the new tree`s. The "slow movement" when pushing/pulling an object is a great idea, it would definally be worth adding, but I`m not sure exactly how though.. I`m still thinking about how to do the push n pull (and make purpur follow the blocks).
Puzzles.. Hm, I had a similar idea to your sodoku puzzle before (it was for a game I never finsihed), the floor was covered in symbols which the player could activate, and in order for the player to move to the next room he`d have to activate the right one`s in the right order.
So far, all puzzle elements in "a purpur tale" is blocks and arrow squares. The blocks will be important ofc, and there will be alot of them. The normal push blocks could be pushed uppon arrow squares and there is a different kind of arrow square which purpur can stand on. The arrow squares will work like a conveyor (but you know this already).
Besides those I`ve not really thought of any good ones.... I have been thinking alot but I can`t come up with anything There is always "run around in different roms and press different button puzzles, but personally I`m not too fond of those.
Since I use a kind of big grid it would be hard to add good agility tests too, it`s kind of hard to fall into a hole by accident while moving Ice might work though, when he moves Purpur could keep moving untill he hit`s something? Might be something you could use in your game too?
Yes I do know I`ll have might have to change more things if I start to come up with new things now, thats why I`ve not done one singel event since we started talking about it. Might as well sort the good ideas out first.
Could I see how the events for the AI looks right now? I might have some ideas, even if I`m not that good with setting events.
I have tried the last version you uploaded on you game. It has kind of cute grapic, the lack of colors make it look like a gameboy game though (which is not a bad thing), but why is it so small?
I'm running in to the same kind of problems with my own game now.
I want to add ice (I stole the idea off Golden Sun, but I see you had the same thought) and rolling balls, but it's probably going to mean starting almost from scratch - problem here is that several blocks can be sliding at the same time, so checking for collisions etc is hard. I also wanted long grass that slows the player down (for purely aesthetic reasons). The easiest thing to do would be to store everything in a big array, but I can't anything til I decide on either one huge map or an overworld map with lots of sub-levels.
EDIT: Actually I might be able to fix it to disable all other events until the moving block has stopped. That may even be a good thing. I think it's what GoldenSun does.
The graphics in my game are currently just placeholders.
The real ones will look like this:
I realise that they are small, but that's for several reasons...
* they look more retro - snes era hopefully
* small detailed graphics look better than big bland graphics (and I'm much better at pixel art)
* small graphics take less time - I want my game to be fairly big eventually, meaning lots of graphics.
I'm really hoping to put together a very simple, solid game engine, add a basic NPC dialogue system and some simple kind of combat, and then just create loads of different environments with different graphics. I don't want to have to change any events whether the players in a castle or swamp or desert etc.
I'm considering making it a bit like "Indiana Jones' Desktop Adventures" by randomizing large amounts of the game. Basically, I'd have maybe 30 each of sokoban, sudoku, maze, theseus&minotaur, etc types of puzzle. Each quest would contain a random selection of maybe 10 puzzles and some combat and exploring (items would be placed randomly). The idea is that it will be more of a tea-break game, with a game taking only half an hour or so and being different every time you played. For those who want a long term challenge, you could have the option to play another quest with the same character (still with the same items), with tougher puzzles and monsters.
Anyway, first things first - I need to get this engine completed.
Oh, you`r really good at pixelart. The walls look really SNES like, I really like the doors too. The floor looks a little weird though, I I don`t know if it is supposed to look like that or not... I`m talking about the brownish part.
I`ve looked at the file now and I must say, I don`t understand much of the baddy movement(I had the feeling I would`t), not the events and not how they moved when I tried the game (they all moved like crazy in the beginning and then put themself in front of the bridge and then stopped moving. It looked a little fun though. I`ve been kind of busy lately, being sick among other things but when I get some more time on my hands I`ll try to figure out what it is you`ve done.
I noticed that you have done some other things as well though.. the treasure chest won`t show though the roof anymore, great! I was actually thinking about how I would correct that bug. Thank you alot. About the roof "fade" though, does it not look a little weird? I suppose the purpose was to get it to appear and disappear in a more smoth manner? I`m not sure if it has to do with my computer or not but it kind of "blinks" a couple of times then disappear/appear. Looks a little.. odd?
Again, you changed purpurs movement so it use alterable values, sounds good, but I don`t understand it yet.. so I`ll look into it some more.
Then there is the zelda scrolling, which I suppose only takes effect while moving in between to frames? You left a note there which said something like "for zelda scrolling to work the map needs to be remodeled". I don`t remember exactly.. would you care to explain?
Sounds like you`r trying to do something that could be pretty difficult to pull off, but if you succeded it would surely be an awesome game. I take it your thread about permadeath has something to do with this game? If that`s so, I think it would be cool with some kind of highscore? Maybe a "hall of fame"? Just a thought.
Anyway, isn`t 30 puzzles to few if they are going to be used again and again? Or will there be a random factor to each puzzle?
[EDIT; oh! there is two questions about MMF2. I`m not used to it yet and while clicking in TGF you could easily select a tile(grapic) and press the right mouse button if you wanted to place more then one of the same tile, this does not work in mmf2? Also A feature I used alot in TGF when importing grapic was "create a new *****" which would let me create a new backdrop/active or whatever with the exact same grapic, but still it wouldn`t be the same tile as the other one. They if the name of the first one was "grass tile 1" for example the next one would be named "grass tile 2" automatically. Really handy when importing a grapic tile that will need to be visible from 4 different directions. All I would have to do was copy and rotate, it even renamed itselft correctly.]
To create more of an object, hold down ctrl and drag it. You can also right-click an object and use "duplicate".
To create more identical but different (?) objects, right click on one, and select "clone".
The brown part of the floor is supposed to be wooden floorboards. 20x20 is an awkward tile size, and means I can't make all the boards the same width, so it looks a bit weird. I'll probably have carpets on a lot of the floors, with the wood just showing around the edge maybe. I don't know - It's early days.
Funny about the roof fade. It doesn't look good on my pc either. Most proper games seem to use some kind of fade and it looks really good, so I don't know what I'm doing wrong.
The thing with the zelda scrolling, is that it jumps in big steps. You'll want to make it so the house is centred in the frame. It's not a big deal, but it looks better. Just think about where the edges of each screen will be when you place objects.
The permadeath would indeed be for this game. There will be a (online?) highscore table - that's why I don't want people to be able to cheat. I don't know if 30 of each type of puzzle is too few. If I have 5 types of puzzle (I want more really) that's 150 different puzzles. If a quest involves 10 puzzles interspersed with wandering around and fighting monsters, then you shouldn't be replaying the same puzzles too often. I'm sure it'll be easier to create some types of puzzle than others. With some puzzles, such as the sudoku puzzle, it should be possible to make them randomly generated. Anyway, I still haven't got a working system for pushing blocks etc, and that's my #1 priority. To be honest I haven't done much since downloading Zeliard - it's a great game that I played loads as a kid but could never complete. It's funny how much easier games are nowadays.
Also, chances are this game will never actually be finished. I've been doing this a long time and still haven't finished a full game. If I go away for the winter again, that'll be the end of it
Thanks, I knew those basic functions had to be in mmf too, but I didn´t know how to do it.. Actually I find it a bit disturbing using mmf since I don`t always know were the things I`m looking for is.. so I`ll have to spend time looking for them Becuse of this I`ve been taking some time of the project to explore mmf and all extentions, hopefully get some deeper understanding of the program but I got stuck at exploring the platform movements..
About not finishing games, I think that apply to most of us, I`ve never finished a game I would like to play myself so.. only really basic and booring platformers with really crappy gameplay... = That`s why I would like to compleate the engine before I decide to put the game together, becuse I know there =/
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But this project went from a small random quick creation to a serious project, just look at how the grapic looked in the first uploaded gam. Anyhow, now when it`s come this far I`ve decided to adapt the gameplay so it would fit a bigger audiance. So it will probably be uploaded to DailyClick when it`s finished (I never uploaded any of my games before).
Edited by the Author.
There is always "run around in different roms and press different button puzzles, but personally I`m not too fond of those.
