The Daily Click ::. Forums ::. Klik Coding Help ::. MP3 or OGG?
 

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8th December, 2008 at 06:19:00 -

Just wondering which would be better to use in an MMF2 application.

 
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Ricky

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8th December, 2008 at 06:34:23 -

.ogg

The list of reasons why is too long to post here

 
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8th December, 2008 at 06:49:09 -

I'll take your word for it.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 11:07:18 -

Yeap, OGG. Mostly because of the legal reasons behind it makes it good for games.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 11:18:49 -

I stumbled upon a song which I thought would be perfect to use in my new project. Well, almost perfect, so I edited it slightly in Audacity and exported it as both and MP3 and OGG ('cause I knew MMF2 handles both) but noticed that the OGG was larger in file size... I don't think it's that much of a problem but is using MP3's worth the smaller size, considering the amount of "cons" when compared to OGG?

Edited by -J-

 
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8th December, 2008 at 11:40:49 -

OGG's are smaller then MP3's if you properly convert them. Opening it up and re-saving it, isn't proper converting. I think someone posted a free converter on TDC or Clickteam.com though. Try doing a search? I'm getting ready to leave, or I would do it for you.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 12:47:33 -

Downloading "GoldWave"...

Converting...

...

Well I managed to get my 4.94 MB sized MP3 down to a 1.85 MB OGG file, still preserving the stereo attribute. The song is still 4 - 5 minutes long and I can hardly tell the difference in quality at all!

Thanks for your help.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 15:05:42 -

Neither! Really now, I don't like a game that's fat just because of music size, and not many people do either. But yeah, I'd say whichever is smaller. MP3 is great for keeping music at high-quality at a relatively small size. Not so sure what OGG is for, but you don't really need music-quality sounds in a game.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 15:48:11 -

Low-quality/bitrate music is pretty acceptable for click games, as a lot use MIDIs and MODs.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 16:10:51 -

It really doesn't matter.

If you use high-bitrates you literally won't be able to tell the difference.

If you use low-bitrates there are only minor differences - eg. ogg better preserves high frequencies, while mp3 is better for low frequencies.

Ogg does use more processing power to decode, although I can't believe it's enough to affect the framerate of a game (saps your battery quicker on an mp3 player tho).

 
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8th December, 2008 at 16:16:21 -


Originally Posted by Muz [AFK]
Not so sure what OGG is for, but you don't really need music-quality sounds in a game.



On the contrary. I've been going through my game replacing the .wav sound effects with .ogg and the difference in filesize, even for split second sounds is quite astonishing and I've already cut the game down by 5mb. OGG for all! I say.

Oh and MMF2 has native OGG support, mr. OP. So when you build the game the music will be stored within the .exe all safey wafey.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 16:25:46 -

I will have to remember to do that.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 17:17:43 -

I would be perfectly willing to use midis for vitalize games if they didn't freeze my applications while looping.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 17:26:14 -

Generally OGG is the better choice.

Goldwave is what I use to convert music files to OGG for MMF2

 
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8th December, 2008 at 19:45:37 -


Originally Posted by Muz [AFK]
Neither! Really now, I don't like a game that's fat just because of music size, and not many people do either. But yeah, I'd say whichever is smaller. MP3 is great for keeping music at high-quality at a relatively small size. Not so sure what OGG is for, but you don't really need music-quality sounds in a game.



I disagree. A good sound track is always one my more memorable features. And it's not like with OGG, you'll have external files flailing all over the place. You can put OGG's in MMF2, just like you could MIDI in MMF 1.5.

 
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8th December, 2008 at 21:31:02 -

Hmm. usually I use MP3 or WAV files, but I really should do OGG. haven't found any files of that type on my Comp yet tho.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 17:21:04 -


Originally Posted by AndyUK
Generally OGG is the better choice.

Goldwave is what I use to convert music files to OGG for MMF2



I'll have to look up goldwave because the free converter I have also makes my .oggs bigger than the original mp3s.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 17:23:34 -

Blah, it's $45?

I got burned for buying Midimaker before, and that was only $20. What do you guys do use the trial version?

 
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9th December, 2008 at 17:30:38 -

i use this nifty little thing called mp3 convertor simple. its a 30 use trial version that doesnt seem to care how many times you actually use it.

http://www.software-download.org/mp3converter_simple.exe

 
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9th December, 2008 at 17:31:36 -

I convert with audacity. If you lower the quality setting (i don't notice a difference) you can get .oggs half the size of their mp3 counterpart (if the mp3 was high quality to begin with)

 
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9th December, 2008 at 18:40:40 -

um, you can make Mp3's half the size of the original is you change the quality settings. On an equal quality basis OGG files aren't all that smaller in file size.

The reason why you probably wont find any OGG files on your computer at the moment is because the Mp3 format pretty much dominates, so no one uses OGG, i don't think windows media player even supports OGG playback for some reason.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 18:46:17 -


Originally Posted by Ricky
I convert with audacity. If you lower the quality setting (i don't notice a difference) you can get .oggs half the size of their mp3 counterpart (if the mp3 was high quality to begin with)



I use Audacity too, import the songs as fully uncompressed Aiffs, do some normalising and balancing then convert to a full quality OGG.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 19:25:09 -

Personally I'd rather download a larger file with proper music than the same game with '90s midi music (that's always too loud when you first start the game).

 
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9th December, 2008 at 19:39:17 -

What's a bit rubbish with midis is that different soundcards render the instruments differently. For that reason I haven't used midi's in any of my post-KnP games. They're too troublesome for their own good especially when you can use the mod format. But yea MP3/OGG may bump the size but at least you have full creative control over the volume, position and even frequency of tracks.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 19:40:22 -

In every other respect, click games are far more like console games from the '90s (or even '80s in some cases) than a game you might pick off the shelf in a store today. I think '90s midi/mod music is usually more in keeping.

Imagine Zelda for example (could be any game of that era or older), but with cd quality recordings of a real orchestra - it would be technically more advanced, but the music wouldn't fit the style of the game and it would lessen many people's enjoyment of it.

That's what I think anyway.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 21:17:26 -

Actually, the few very good klik games we've had from time to time, are far less like 90's games, and more like today's casual games, found around Popcap and such. In which case, an OGG would be a far more acceptable quality for music. I mean it's stupid to compare klik games to the main stream games. Compare them more to games like Insaniquarium and Bejeweled 2. Both of which use higher quality music formats then MIDI for sure.

 
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9th December, 2008 at 21:34:20 -

I guess it depends on which you consider good games.

I don't want to get into an argument over this, but IN MY PERSONAL OPINION, the vast majority of (not all) flash games (including those on popcap) are pretty crap, and not what I'd hope clickers would aspire to create. They're borderline-entertaining for a very short time, and that's it.

What I consider the *good* click games - eg. Eternal Daughter and the others at the top of the "most downloaded" list - are far more like old console games (snes era possibly?).

I know nothing about the game Julian is making, so I'm not going to speculate on what might be the best music format for him to use.

Edited by Sketchy

 
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9th December, 2008 at 22:25:31 -

I think it's largely based on the graphical style you choose. Most pixel art based games will find themselves feeling more comfortable with MIDI or other similar formatted music. However games with more Photoshop, 3D Studio, or other forms of standard graphics, will generally be expected to have higher quality formatted music.

 
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10th December, 2008 at 01:31:18 -

yes. i agree 100%

 
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