Apple forces you to create an AppleID account if you want to buy anything. This really pissed me off.
Next I find the book only comes in the ePub format. This pisses me off because I wanted to print it at my local library which only allows PDF printing.
Then I spend an hour trying to convert it to PDF. NO LUCK! This pisses me off.
Then I spend an hour downloading different ePub viewer programs. NONE CAN OPEN THE FILE. This pisses me off.
THEN I spend an hour reading about Apples shitty iBook eBook format. It is very boring and pisses me off.
THEN I learn that only an iPad can view my book.
No way would I every own an iPad. I am so pissed off. I hate Apple so much. I want to blow up my local Apple store. Or at least take hostage all the employees (probably kill a few to show I mean business) and fight off the police until they meet my demands: a helicopter and my $9.95 back.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . Why did you purchase something you couldn't use?
Why don't Apple start using the most prevalent industry standard than making their own proprietary formats all the time? Same with connectors, proprietary connectors piss me off no end - use standard mini/micro USB ffs!
Is it unreasonable to think that a book purchased on iTunes would be readable in iTunes? It's not an app written for specific hardware, it's a glorified textfile. There's no reason why a PC shouldn't be able to read it.
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
Originally Posted by Phredreeke Is it unreasonable to think that a book purchased on iTunes would be readable in iTunes?
No, I assumed they were. Of course app's you purchase on iTunes aren't playable on itunes either.
I don't blame them for making their own format, it's because they are profit driven. That's the only motivation for them to keep producing new products. I'd do the same.
Originally Posted by marky_2 Hopefully Apple goes out of business soon.
What an uneducated statement. They aren't going anywhere anytime soon.
Originally Posted by Phredreeke Is it unreasonable to think that a book purchased on iTunes would be readable in iTunes?
No, I assumed they were. Of course app's you purchase on iTunes aren't playable on itunes either.
Yes, but there's a difference between an app (which after all is designed for a specific architecture in mind) and an eBook (in this case using a variant of XML).
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : .
I don't blame them for making their own format, it's because they are profit driven. That's the only motivation for them to keep producing new products. I'd do the same.
Wait, you're saying people should buy iPods/iPads/iPhones because of a proprietary format, NOT because it's a quality product?
Anyway, there's the risk that it will come back and bite Apple in the ass, if people decide that it's not worth buying a vendorlocked format and rather download illegally instead.
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
Originally Posted by Phredreeke Wait, you're saying people should buy iPods/iPads/iPhones because of a proprietary format, NOT because it's a quality product?
Of course not.
Originally Posted by Phredreeke Anyway, there's the risk that it will come back and bite Apple in the ass, if people decide that it's not worth buying a vendorlocked format and rather download illegally instead.
Yep, but have you met the people who use apple products? I doubt many of them know how to pirate files.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . Why did you purchase something you couldn't use?
Why don't Apple start using the most prevalent industry standard than making their own proprietary formats all the time? Same with connectors, proprietary connectors piss me off no end - use standard mini/micro USB ffs!
because many people are so loyal to Apple that they'll just buy whatever they need to do deal with their proprietary crap. More money for Apple.
Apple are a crappy brand just like RyanAir - they make a basic product which initially seems like quite an attractive proposition, and then they find a million other ways to screw you out of more money later on (except with Apple, it's more like RyanAir quality at British Airways prices).
Unless you have to use a mac for work, you'd do well to avoid anything made by Apple.
So I submited the following message to the apple support page:
To whom it may concern,
About an hour ago I purcahed the iBook "The Art of Building a House of Stone" off iTunes. After an hour of researching I discovered there is no way to view an iBook on my computer. I don't own any apple products except from an old iPod.
The iBook cost me $9.95. I am very very poor and to me this is a large amount of money and is enough to feed my family for a week. I am asking for a refund as I have no way to view this book and as far as I could tell I thought that I would be able to.
Thank you for your time,
Chris Burrows
And today I recieved this:
Dear Chris,
Greetings from iTunes Store Customer Support. My name is Nagaraj and I am happy to assist you today.
I understand that you are unable to view iBook on your computer and you would like to get a refund. I can imagine you must be eager to get this taken care of. I am happy to assist.
Chris, after reviewing the circumstances of your case, we determined that issuing you a refund for your unintentional purchase of "The Art of Building a House of Stone" is an appropriate exception to the iTunes Store Terms and Conditions, which state that all sales are final. In five to seven business days, a credit of 9.99 AUD should be posted to the credit card that appears on the receipt for that purchase.
Thank you for your continued support to the iTunes Store. Please do not hesitate to contact me in case you have further questions regarding this issue.
It appears mr. Nagaraj didn't even understand your predicament. You did not unintentionally buy the book. You very well DID buy it with the intention of reading it. It was apple who failed to effectively let you know that you could ONLY read it on an iPad which you do not own.
Good to hear you're getting a refund regardless. When my account was hacked and 100+ dollars was charged for games and apps i didn't want, they told me that all sales were final and that it was my credit card providers responsibility to refund me for the fraudulent charges. Luckily my credit card did refund me, and i got to keep all the shit on my account as well.
But seriously, apple is complete garbage. They're only useful for when i want to legitimately buy music or movies instantly. other than that, garbage.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . I wouldn't recommend a mac over a PC, you'd get more for the price with a PC.
I can understand buying an iphone, but the rest is quite a waste.
I'm just saying that they know how to make money and you can't fault them for that.
I actually think the way Apple operate is not sustainable. For the time being, they are making a shed-load of money, basically just off the "coolness" of the brand. However, if they continue to operate the way they are now, they will seriously devalue the brand - people will no longer think of them as being cool, but as being a money-grabbing evil empire. The public as a whole, are pretty dumb, so it probably won't happen for another 5+ years, but it will happen.
I think the only good reason for choosing a Mac over a PC would be if you're in the graphic design industry (or a few others). In that case, Macs are still very much the "industry standard", so it's easier to get hired if you have experience of Macs, and if you're a business it's easier to find employees with experience of Macs. Apart from that, Apple products are just a rip-off.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . I wouldn't recommend a mac over a PC, you'd get more for the price with a PC.
Well, there's one case where a Mac might be preferrable - if you're buying it for your kid. Macs are harder to f*** up than PCs.
I think your right there.
I got a iphone 3gs on contract a couple months back and I'm kind of regretting it now as I now know how limited the devices are. My old G1/HTC Dream android phone could do more this this thing can, don't have proper bluetooth support which I found out the hard way...
I have to say though I love the touchscreen on iphone, it's so responsive.
Apple forces you to create an AppleID account if you want to buy anything. This really pissed me off.
Next I find the book only comes in the ePub format. This pisses me off because I wanted to print it at my local library which only allows PDF printing.
Then I spend an hour trying to convert it to PDF. NO LUCK! This pisses me off.
Then I spend an hour downloading different ePub viewer programs. NONE CAN OPEN THE FILE. This pisses me off.
THEN I spend an hour reading about Apples shitty iBook eBook format. It is very boring and pisses me off.
THEN I learn that only an iPad can view my book.
No way would I every own an iPad. I am so pissed off. I hate Apple so much. I want to blow up my local Apple store. Or at least take hostage all the employees (probably kill a few to show I mean business) and fight off the police until they meet my demands: a helicopter and my $9.95 back.
1. i agree apple is pretty shit
2. i think its pretty reasonable they want you to create an appleID. i mean amazon asks for an account and so does ebay or any place where you purchase stuff so I think you cant really blame apple for that one
3. i know its really frustrating. maybe you can find a PDF version of that book and WAREZ it. overall i warez stuff because if you actually BUY their products they will fuck with you like they did in your case which is just UNFAIR to the customer. so maybe you can pirate the PDF. serves them right.
also sorry to hear all that trouble you went through. its really cruel and shit but thats the way apple operates. yet people love to say microsoft are nazis while they never behaved like apple does yet i hear no one complain about apple but you so i hope it will become more people. its just terrible service.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . Why did you purchase something you couldn't use?
Why don't Apple start using the most prevalent industry standard than making their own proprietary formats all the time? Same with connectors, proprietary connectors piss me off no end - use standard mini/micro USB ffs!
ePub file format is the industry standard for ebooks that are readable through tablet devices, it's not just limited to Apple devices and it sure isn't their own proprietary format. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EPUB
Here's a list of devices that use the epub file format.
Apple iPad
Barnes and Noble NOOK
Sony Reader (Pocket/Daily/Touch Edition and PRS-505)
Bookeen Cybook OPUS
So yeah, they ARE using the most prevalent industry standard. PDF files have been the cause of several security flaws in the iPhone and other devices, allowing hackers to jailbreak/root the devices through running code using these flaws in PDF files. It's no wonder Apple are trying to avoid PDFs.
I'm sick of people whining about Apple products. I use both Macs and PC during my work, and they do the job they are supposed to do. There is no reason I can see, besides feeling like you need to occupy a city, that you are against Apple products when you clearly have no idea about the issues that make you so angry.
I absolutely love my iphone 4 and I never owned an apple phone before that, From the great screen to the touch controls and all the apps you can get from the app store, it is awesome, I cant wait to get my hands on the iphone 5 next year
Thumbs up to Apple
Be sure to follow us on the twitters for the latest and greatest: @dailyclick
Originally Posted by Rhys D ePub file format is the industry standard for ebooks that are readable through tablet devices, it's not just limited to Apple devices and it sure isn't their own proprietary format.
EPub is the industry standard for ebooks: CORRECT
They are readable through any tablet device: WRONG
Why? Thanks to Device Rights Management. DRM is what publishers use to restrict what you can do with your ebooks. DRM controls which devices you can use to read your ebook and it will prevent you from converting from format to another.
In most cases you can remove the DRM from an eBook using various scripts or programs. The exception is with the Apple iBook eBook. Apple is the ONLY COMPANY IN THE WORLD to use their own form of DRM. It is called Fairplay DRM and to this date it is IMPOSSIBLE to remove it. This makes it IMPOSSIBLE to view an Apple ePub iBook eBook on anything but an iPad/iPhone. How shit.
I'm not a fan either. I purchased an imac a few years ago because I was convinced it would be perfect for video editing/graphics work/etc. And while it's a standard to . . . some. . . degree, unless you're working directly for a company that requires it, I've seen it do nothing my PC can't do just as well. The OS is just plain clumsy for multitasking no matter how many ways I've configured it. The mouse acceleration curve makes doing any simple task like writing a 40 page paper with your non dominant hand.
BUT, I just bought an ipod touch. I bought it specifically for developing apps using clickteam's new ios exporter. But what a great device. It's apples to oranges, but ios is far superior to osx for what it is. Apple could probably sell a rock with an apple logo on it to a million people, but with the pod/pad/phone they've actually made a genuinely good product.
Rhys D, I own an Iliad IREX (it can takes notes via a touch screen. It's a bit old but great for academia as it can open PDF's natively and I can make notes on them...). It can only open DRM free EPUB format and as Chris has stated, Apple have given the EPUB format a good old fashioned Apple styled coating of proprietary format.
If I pay my money for any form of digital content, I do not expect it be locked to that particular manufacture's devices, total bullshit and bullshit I will never support.
Come on Apple fans then, give me a reason why Apple does not use standard USB connectors on their mobile devices? Does the Apple proprietary connector help the communications link go faster than the USB 2 port it is plugged in to?
@Sketchy: Totally agree, I hope the people wake up sometime soon.
So yeah, they ARE using the most prevalent industry standard. PDF files have been the cause of several security flaws in the iPhone and other devices, allowing hackers to jailbreak/root the devices through running code using these flaws in PDF files. It's no wonder Apple are trying to avoid PDFs.
Apple devices can still read PDFs...
Originally Posted by Rikus Yea why so much hate for apple.
Well, in this case it's rather obvious, selling eBooks that are not readable in their own software (iTunes).
Now Apple has done good things. For one popularizing the AAC format (it is superior to MP3 on a technical level)
As for the bad, this is what I can think of:
- High price to capacity ratio for flash devices
- Forcing the user to use iTunes to upload music and other media (now, for the technically unproficient, this is actually an advantage...)
- Strong control over what apps can run on their devices (again an advantage for the technically unproficient as it protects them from malware, also the same can be said for other closed platforms)
- Now what bothers apple-haters the most is that despite the above, it's still popular!
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
So yeah, they ARE using the most prevalent industry standard. PDF files have been the cause of several security flaws in the iPhone and other devices, allowing hackers to jailbreak/root the devices through running code using these flaws in PDF files. It's no wonder Apple are trying to avoid PDFs.
Apple devices can still read PDFs...
Originally Posted by Rikus Yea why so much hate for apple.
Well, in this case it's rather obvious, selling eBooks that are not readable in their own software (iTunes).
Now Apple has done good things. For one popularizing the AAC format (it is superior to MP3 on a technical level)
As for the bad, this is what I can think of:
- High price to capacity ratio for flash devices
- Forcing the user to use iTunes to upload music and other media (now, for the technically unproficient, this is actually an advantage...)
- Strong control over what apps can run on their devices (again an advantage for the technically unproficient as it protects them from malware, also the same can be said for other closed platforms)
- Now what bothers apple-haters the most is that despite the above, it's still popular!
I know they can still read PDF's, I was just saying there has been security flaws before involving PDF files and the iPhone.
Apple only have strong control over what apps get passed review because they want a standard of quality on the app store, compared to the Android Marketplace. I'll admit the standards of the apps on the App Store is getting lower as time progresses, but compared to the amount of absolute shite on the Android Marketplace and the fact that anyone can submit without review, it's miles above the rest.
Other devices force the user to use proprietary software as well, look at the Windows phones and ZUNE by Microsoft. It's about resource control. They are more likely to get less technical issues and irate customers bogging down support lines if they are all using the same software.
The DRM is added to eBooks, movies, apps etc to protect copyright and ensure the creators are getting paid. DRM can be a nuisance, but if you buy a product via a specific medium or for a specific device/software, you can't reasonably accept they would love to see you use it on a competitors device or share it round with your friends.
I would rather have the choice to find out myself if an application for my android is crap, rather than letting a company decide for me, and at least I can install apps not available on the app market without having to jailbreak my phone (emulators). To me defending a company restricting what I can run on a device I have paid for is defending the indefensible.
It's about time there was a standard for DRM (although I am against it, if prices was more reasonable piracy would probably be minimal) set by regulatory bodies and not any individual company, much like there is in electronics.
I know they can still read PDF's, I was just saying there has been security flaws before involving PDF files and the iPhone.
And the security flaws are totally unrelated to the choice of eBook format on the iTunes store.
Originally Posted by Rhys D
Apple only have strong control over what apps get passed review because they want a standard of quality on the app store, compared to the Android Marketplace. I'll admit the standards of the apps on the App Store is getting lower as time progresses, but compared to the amount of absolute shite on the Android Marketplace and the fact that anyone can submit without review, it's miles above the rest.
Well, that sounds nice in theory, but in practice there are too many apps released to give each an individual quality evaluation.
Originally Posted by Rhys D
Other devices force the user to use proprietary software as well, look at the Windows phones and ZUNE by Microsoft. It's about resource control. They are more likely to get less technical issues and irate customers bogging down support lines if they are all using the same software.
Notice how it's two industry giants who force the use of proprietary software. If a smaller company such as Sandisk can support a standard MSC or MTP interface without being bogged down by support calls then why can't the industry giants do it?
Originally Posted by Rhys D
The DRM is added to eBooks, movies, apps etc to protect copyright and ensure the creators are getting paid. DRM can be a nuisance, but if you buy a product via a specific medium or for a specific device/software, you can't reasonably accept they would love to see you use it on a competitors device or share it round with your friends.
Now you're putting words in my mouth. I never said they should release eBooks DRM free, what I said was it is stupid that they can't be read in their own software i.e. iTunes.
Edited by Phredreeke
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
Originally Posted by ..::hagar::.. I would rather have the choice to find out myself if an application for my android is crap, rather than letting a company decide for me, and at least I can install apps not available on the app market without having to jailbreak my phone (emulators). To me defending a company restricting what I can run on a device I have paid for is defending the indefensible.
It's about time there was a standard for DRM (although I am against it, if prices was more reasonable piracy would probably be minimal) set by regulatory bodies and not any individual company, much like there is in electronics.
Gotta disagree with you on this one (the top part). Apple's approval process might have some flaws, but it does help strain out the crap. The success of the app store versus android is proof of that. It is good for developer's and good for customers. The only people it's not good for is people shoveling out garbage. They won't make money with it, they just clog up the system and make it that much harder for the quality products to get noticed. And yes, I know there's a lot of crap even on the app store, but imagine if they got rid of the price of entry and let anyone upload whatever they want whenever they want, in whatever quantity they want.
Originally Posted by ..::hagar::.. I would rather have the choice to find out myself if an application for my android is crap, rather than letting a company decide for me, and at least I can install apps not available on the app market without having to jailbreak my phone (emulators). To me defending a company restricting what I can run on a device I have paid for is defending the indefensible.
It's about time there was a standard for DRM (although I am against it, if prices was more reasonable piracy would probably be minimal) set by regulatory bodies and not any individual company, much like there is in electronics.
Gotta disagree with you on this one (the top part). Apple's approval process might have some flaws, but it does help strain out the crap. The success of the app store versus android is proof of that. It is good for developer's and good for customers. The only people it's not good for is people shoveling out garbage. They won't make money with it, they just clog up the system and make it that much harder for the quality products to get noticed. And yes, I know there's a lot of crap even on the app store, but imagine if they got rid of the price of entry and let anyone upload whatever they want whenever they want, in whatever quantity they want.
Then the applications get flagged, they get reviewed, they get taken down, the developer gets his or her account terminated.
The biggest issue with Android is device fragmentation.
There are too many different OS versions and hardware specs to worry about when developing for them.
A headache I'd rather not deal with, at least with iPhone you can assume that the majority of people have either one of the last two revisions of the phone.
Originally Posted by . : UrbanMonk : . The biggest issue with Android is device fragmentation.
There are too many different OS versions and hardware specs to worry about when developing for them.
A headache I'd rather not deal with, at least with iPhone you can assume that the majority of people have either one of the last two revisions of the phone.
Yeah, Android is more PC-like than iPhone, for better and for worse.
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
In all seriousness I still do not agree with filtering any form of app store (apart from malicious apps). If an app is crap let the market and the end users decide if it's crap or not. I think it's totally wrong for a company to have such control over a market (like the banned game Phone Story).
I actually agree that the Android Market is not monitored enough. It's not the only source for applications on Android (unlike the App Store on iOS) so I think it wouldn't hurt if Google was a lot more controlling.
Its not that hard to develop for the android regardless of various hardware specs. Develop for a minimum spec or an average spec. Or develop for a specific phone. The marketplace does allow for limiting sales of an application to specific devices and/or service providers.
In all seriousness I still do not agree with filtering any form of app store (apart from malicious apps). If an app is crap let the market and the end users decide if it's crap or not. I think it's totally wrong for a company to have such control over a market (like the banned game Phone Story).
Well I knew someone would bring crappy apps up which is why I said
"And yes, I know there's a lot of crap even on the app store, but imagine if they got rid of the price of entry and let anyone upload whatever they want whenever they want, in whatever quantity they want."
in my original post.
I do not see how apple controlling the content that shows up in their store is any different than nintendo or microsoft controlling the content that is approved for their platforms, be it physical or digital. If you want an open platform, there's android. Nobody is forcing anyone to develop for ios versus android, so for those that want a more controlled platform, they can have it, and for those that don't, they can have that too.
Advertisement
Post Reply
Edited by an Administrator
What good reason does Apple have for that? Security issues perhaps? 
