I think that may have been the reason. The owner of the Star Fleet site SFXB is slightly on the inside track with the distributors and seems to think the Japanese thought we were selling a commercial game over here in the UK.
Either way they've been unreasonable - either by not doing their homework or by ... just being unreasonable.
So I want to thank everyone again for stinging these guys with emails. It's good to remind companies that we don't have to bend over just 'cos they tell us to. They rely on us, not the other way around.
If anyone else has fired them emails - drop me a line. I might not be able to afford to buy you each a crate of beer but I'll make sure you're in the credits for the next version (whenever that will be).
No, they were NOT being unreasonable. IF you were selling the game, they very well would have had a case, because you would have owed them a licensing fee. That's not unreasonable at all.
It is fully within their rights to request the takedown, and I'm rather taken aback at the reactions from the community. Especially considering the Fair Use clause everyone is falling back on is an AMERICAN law. The show is Japanese in origin and the specific version that this game is based on is from the UK. The page is also hosted by a UK company. While I am unsure of the specifics of the UK version of the law, there are still the Japanese laws regarding this issue to consider.
While I'm sure you guys feel that flooding these person's email boxes with support for the game will help your position, from a number of reactions I've read from the official site, I can only assume that a good portion of these emails are poorly written and abusive towards the IP owners. This is NOT the way to get things done, and would reflect rather poorly on the creator of the game. Also putting "two fingers up" at the people who own the IP is a very poor and juvenile action.
Well if you look at it from the Law's point of view, yes it's perfectly fine to demand whatever you want when it's your own IP. Especially so when money comes into it.
But speaking morally, throwing your weight around when it comes to fangames will only make you look like a dick. Thus the reaction from the community.
I don't see Sega and Nintendo trying to close down Mario fangames galaxy or Sonic fangames headquarters,
so it's not like it's expected.
Originally Posted by AndyUK Well if you look at it from the Law's point of view, yes it's perfectly fine to demand whatever you want when it's your own IP. Especially so when money comes into it.
But speaking morally, throwing your weight around when it comes to fangames will only make you look like a dick. Thus the reaction from the community.
I don't see Sega and Nintendo trying to close down Mario fangames galaxy or Sonic fangames headquarters,
so it's not like it's expected.
Not anymore anyway (Nintendo). Any Nintendo fangame that even got a sliver of internet fame used to get shut down.
But speaking of morality, what's more moral? Asking someone to take down a game based on your IP, or being a flippant prick when someone asks you to take down something you don't own? We're not talking about some company wanting to take it down. The CREATOR of the show himself is the one who wants it taken down. We're still unsure of his reasons though, he could just be overly protective of his creation, or he could be under the belief that the game is for-profit. There is a language barrier complicating things here. More information would definitely help. But I still think the manner that the creator of the game dealt with this is exceedingly poor and will only hurt him (and his game) in the long run.
yeah it's stupid and also highly disrespectful to gather a huge army to spam angry messages to someone because they're trying to protect their ip.
But i also think it's unfair to stop allowing fans do what fans do. Now things like piracy are worth stopping, but fangames? freeware fangames at that? surely it will only hurt the owners reputation.
Oh I'm not saying it won't damage their reputation. Encouraging the fans to make their own content (within limits) has help lots of frachises, specifically the two major Star franchises. Paramount in particular has a fantastic relationship with the trek fans, even to the point where Paramount has utilized some of the sets fans have made for their own shows in their official productions and in return helped those fan show creators get in contact with actors/writers to help with the fan productions.
What bothers me about this whole thing is that the creator of the game seem to feel a sense of entitlement to the IP, and instead of trying to work with the owners of the IP, has instead chosen to decry themselves as persecuted and battle back in such a way that they undermine their whole argument (we help people get interested in the show).
I would just like to point out to the poster Knudde - that Fair Use Law is part of UK law right now and in a number of other countries. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about right from the start.
I feel no ownership of the IP in question however I do feel that I have earned the right to my game, having written it over the course of over 6 years as opposed to the distributors who have done nothing whatsoever in comparison.
I have offered to work in partnership with the distributors as can be read from my email.
I feel understandably hurt by the fact that I have been NEEDLESSLY threatened with legal action over this.
Your points made about money and revenue here are irrelevant as I have never received a penny or as much as been bought a drink for my work on X-Bomber.
Calling me a prick doesn't make me inclined to listen to your argument - especially when it is spurious and full of inaccuracies.
Of course they were being unreasonable to threaten me with legal action when no profit is being made here. You have completely missed the point.
If you're not willing to help then I would simply ask that you please leave this topic well alone.
I would question how well or graciously Knudde would react to actually being threatened with legal action and how he would feel in my position. It's all very well to decry me when you have absolutely no idea or personal concept of the background to this or to the situation I've been placed in.
Even the UK distributors seem to have realised that they've made a mistake and are preparing to talk to Enoki about their apparent mistake. Therefore your opinion seems rather irrelevant.
no offense but no. his argument stands. you have dealt with it right AND wrong. emailing them back is the right thing to do, to settle the matter. asking the members of multiple forums to spam everyone affiliated with the takedown request is wrong. shab's (knudde) point is that they have the RIGHT, even as your game is freeware, to make the request. it is youre responsibility to prove it falls under the fair use law either to them or by the use of law/lawyers.
also your argument that its taken 6 years of your life to produce is not valid. its like saying it took 6 years to make a virus so its only fiar that you get to use it. they might be afraid of the effects your game might cause assuming theyre releasing the show on dvd? so your time means nothing.
That analogy is ridiculous - viruses and fan-games are NOTHING alike.
I don't think this qualifies as spamming as the subject pertains directly to the companies in question.
Please choose your comparisons more carefully.
I agree that it is their right in law to make me defend the use of their IP in my game but I don't really think it necessary or just, when it's so obviously not causing anyone any harm.
viruses harm things. your game, IN THIS CASE!, may be seen as something that may harm them in some way shape or form.
asking members of multiple forums to flood several peoples inboxes with negative mail is spam.
get over yourself. lifes not fair. go talk to ashley who's building construct about being accused by the legal system. this community knows full well about legal issues and accusations. we just went through it passively if not personally. we dont need it right now.
You don't need it? How much do you think I need this problem? Like a hole in the head, let me tell you. If you feel you don't need the irritation then simply leave this matter well alone. Having a go at me won't solve anything.
Of course life's not fair - what irritates me is people who just shrug their shoulders and are content to leave it that way.
I don't know anything about Construct but I get the feeling that if everyone were like you, that project wouldn't have even started.
Maybe irrelevant, but I doubt that Construct would have failed to start. I don't think Scirra told everyone they were going to make Construct before they started.
Originally Posted by Crash I would just like to point out to the poster Knudde - that Fair Use Law is part of UK law right now and in a number of other countries. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about right from the start.
I feel no ownership of the IP in question however I do feel that I have earned the right to my game, having written it over the course of over 6 years as opposed to the distributors who have done nothing whatsoever in comparison.
I have offered to work in partnership with the distributors as can be read from my email.
I feel understandably hurt by the fact that I have been NEEDLESSLY threatened with legal action over this.
Your points made about money and revenue here are irrelevant as I have never received a penny or as much as been bought a drink for my work on X-Bomber.
Calling me a prick doesn't make me inclined to listen to your argument - especially when it is spurious and full of inaccuracies.
Of course they were being unreasonable to threaten me with legal action when no profit is being made here. You have completely missed the point.
If you're not willing to help then I would simply ask that you please leave this topic well alone.
I would question how well or graciously Knudde would react to actually being threatened with legal action and how he would feel in my position. It's all very well to decry me when you have absolutely no idea or personal concept of the background to this or to the situation I've been placed in.
Even the UK distributors seem to have realised that they've made a mistake and are preparing to talk to Enoki about their apparent mistake. Therefore your opinion seems rather irrelevant.
Edited by the Author.
If you read my post, I specifically said that I am unsure of how the UK law is worded, but the quotes people were throwing around were from the American law. You would have also noticed that I never said anything about you making money, only that they had every right to demand a lisensing fee if you were making money in a hypothetical situation. I also said that it was possible that they thought you were indeed making money from the game, which would have been the reason you got the threats. I know your game is freeware and always has been.
My flippant prick comment was specifically aimed at the latest version you uploaded in which you stated "This release pretty much sticks two fingers up at the takedown request I received from Fabulous Films whose Star Fleet DVDs we've even been advertising for them." I still believe this to be a poor reaction, damaging to your position, and your comment about how you have "earned the right" to your game while the distributors have done nothing only furthered my opinion that you feel a sense of entitlement to the IP. No one is questioning that the game is yours, but the IP it contains is not.
As for your statement regarding being threatened with legal action, I was actually very recently from the publishers of C.O.R.E. for the DS regarding a game I have been working on for a number of years called The Core (I had mocked up a DS screenshot of the game). I explained to them that my game was a freeware pet project that I had been working on for a few years and was unrelated to their project. They apologized for the error and that was the end of the issue. No call to arms, no forum posts.
While the legal threats were "needless" it was perfectly within their rights to do so. I believe that creators should have the rights to their creations. It may be "unreasonable" for them to ask for you to take it down, but it's their right to do so.
And while you may think I was not willing to help, I submitted this email to both Mr. Starks and Mr. Enoki
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Hello Mr. Enoki,
I am writing this letter in regards to the recent Cease & Desist that was sent to the fan game X-Bomber. I am sure you have been assaulted with poorly written, even abusive emails from the supporters of this project. I feel I must apologize on behalf of those people. I fully support your right to protect your Intellectual Property, however I do believe there was a misunderstanding about this project.
The game in question is a fan creation, provided free of charge. No profit will be generated, and to a further extent, no money will be generated at all from this game. For lack of a better term, this is a labor of love for the author; a person who is obviously a fan of the show. It is similar in context to a piece of fan art.
I suggest you look into the various Star Trek fan productions that have cropped up over the years; Paramount has come to realize that fan productions can actually strengthen the brand name. Their only requirements for such productions is that none of the original video material is used in these productions, however they do allow fans to use various sound effects in their productions.
Just to reiterate, I support your position; you have every right to request the takedown.
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