I miss the old days of kliking. Back then it was a thrill to make games. Now I've got these ridiculously high standards, so, it's not really that fun making these games anymore. There's just no thrill to it, no sudden rush of energy to feel.
Back then, there was kind of a thrill to it. A feeling to keep going with an unfinished game. Now, it's just... not there. It's more of a dread to open up a file and swear words, etc when trying to program a realistic physics engine, AI, do the graphics, do neat little special effects that don't work, etc.
IOTM was fun. It was fun to put all my years of experience into the crappiest game I could make in an hour. I dunno what possessed me to make a custom movement engine for that game, though .
And Combatant still is fun to make. The only problem is I never seem to get anywhere with it. It's fun making a random combat generator, random town generators. A bit stressful at times, but still fun.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
theres always fun in making games, if your not enjoying it you should take a break for a while, if your not having fun making it, people arnt going to be having fun playing it.
games dont need realistic physics engines and flashy effects to be fun, they are a nice extra, but not a necessity. look at games classic games like zelda and wonderboy, maybe not everyones cup of tea but the point is they are fantastic games with extremly simple ideas.
i was playing a game called "wandering fighter" today. its soo basic it hurts but damn is that game a joy to play. Its all about fun.
If you didn't have fun throwing stones at a clown, would you bother throwing them at all???
Well, there's some fun, but it tends to get frustrating once a few of the built-in bugs with MMF pop up, like how things tend not to fall at the same time or how certain movement techniques make active objects skip a few pixels on some of the movements.
But on games that are fun to make, was IOTM really as much fun for you all as it was to me?
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
Dustin Gunn Gnarly Tubular Way Cool Awesome Groovy Mondo
Registered 15/12/2004
Points 2659
29th July, 2005 at 02:15:03 -
"Back then, there was kind of a thrill to it. A feeling to keep going with an unfinished game."
What the hell are you even talking about? You never had that, you never finished a game. "Kliking" is the same as it's always been, but making shitty games will always be less fun than making a game anyone will actually want to play.
"But on games that are fun to make, was IOTM really as much fun for you all as it was to me?"
Oh, I am watching the Chapell show and I just need to say,
"IM RICK JAMES, BITCH!!!!!!!"
Can't you tell that I have fun by all the crap that I put out?
I know how you feel. I just want to have fun and feel that rush. I mean jesus, just have fun. I care about graphics but not that much. It is the engine and just overall getting that "high" you get while making a game.....................BITCH!!!!!!!
I still have a little fun kliking, but normally only when I start a project that I can see actually getting finished. Thats when I start working alot faster & more direct & having more fun with it. Normally I dont release games that I dont enjoy for more then 5 minutes anymore though, so its rare that any of my new games are here on DC. Explain anything to anyone? Didnt think so. Anyway, yeah, I'd say kliking is still fun, though not nearly as fun as it was when everything you made in TGF was the best thing in the world in your eyes, only because you thought libs were cool & that everyone would love your game. I can imagen that this is how almost all newbies feel about there still though. After they slowly progress & become better though, there expectations get higher & they put more stress on making sure that its actually good. Thats prolly why it doesnt seem as much fun anymore. Your more bent on making something quality, unlike before when ever anything you did seemed like quality to you. Even if it didnt to everyone else.
Did I make a point to anyone? Maybe perhaps it was just skimmed through? Well this isnt my topic anyway. Continue
I still enjoy klikking, but part of me feels it has gotten less enjoyable than how it used to be. Part of me still feels that this is a competition, and if someone releases a game before you that is better than yours, you feel less motivated to finish it... I should know, hence the countless Wibble Wacky World abandonments.
If you release a demo and all you see is critisism, constructive or not, it will always demotivate you. Loads of people have told me to add weapons to MSD2, and I reluctantly did so. Immediately the game became crappier, so after much pondering I settled for a powerup which gives you a higher jumping ability, faster speed and invincibility all in one. You could also plough through enemies. That would be the only powerup in the game however, but once I thought of the idea, implemented it, it worked rather well, and I got myself motivated again. In addition, MSD2 is to feature at the Click Convention as some of you know; there'll be an inner motivation to tidy up the game and make it look good. But again, all this is to impress, and if people aren't, then demotivation is on the cards.
Basically what I'm trying to say is that its a topsy turvy world. You think of an idea, you get back into the fun of game making, yet when you think of all the competition out there, you feel that your game has to be the absolute best it can be, which takes time, which can be very tiring.
i still say initial engine work is a bitch, and will never be fun
n/a
Pete Nattress Cheesy Bits img src/uploads/sccheesegif
Registered 23/09/2002
Points 4811
29th July, 2005 at 08:44:26 -
To be honest, I haven't done any game making for months. I guess I don't have the time any more. I'm working 2 jobs, one at a supermarket and the other doing ActionScript coding, I've just finished my A-Levels and I'm off to uni in 2 months, so in my free time I'm either playing professional games, writing for my website, or out with my friends. I'd love to get back into game making; perhaps MMF 2 will motivate me. Either that or switch to a "proper" scripting language, like Flash, which will probably make it easier to do the advanced stuff I concoct in my fantasies about making the ulitmate game in the universe. I never made a game I was proud of, if you look on my site, you'll see all the stuff I've churned out is complete turd. Hum ho.
I still enjoy kliking. Every now and then though I come to a point where I've pushed MMF's limits and have to find a way around the limits(which becomes frustrating). Sometimes after working on the same game for a long time,I might get bored of it at points. In those cases, either take a really long break, get a soda out of the fridge to keep me focused(caffeine is a game maker's best friend), or force myself to work on it.
I enjoy kilking the most when just starting a new game. I actually like making a new engine and tweaking it to its best. Once the initial work is done and the first level is finished for example, I get really bored with my games.
Yup. It's easy to fall into the trap where you make an engine for a game, design the first level or two and then promptly leave it to gather dust. I should know, I've done it often enough. I've only finished a few games because of that. It's not hard to pin down *why* I do this - I usually feel as if that's as far as I need to go with a game...or I get other game ideas that are more exciting/interesting, which I then pursue instead. Having said that, there's no denying the satisfaction you get from actually completing a game, whether it's big or small.
I think that if you have an unfinished game that has real potential (to you), you're much more likely to complete it. For example...if you actually find it fun to test the game over and over again =P, or if the game feels like something unique (in comparison to what's out there) with its own style. There is an element of 'competition' present, which probably stems from the fact that you view your game-in-progress as the greatest =P (regardless of popular opinion). That usually changes when you look back at your games =P, but hey - if you don't see your work as anything special at the time, you probably wont get far...
I miss the days where you could pull together the worst game in the world, complete with ripped graphics and minus a custom engine.
And then you have those jackasses who hang around just to rant about how bad a game is.
But Kliking has begun to evolve. We need to change with the times. Besides, now we (or at least some of us, not inculding myself) can produce products that could go on the market.
Nuklear: Just because you watch 'Chapell' doesn't mean we all think you're 'hip wit it'.
Fine Garbage since 2003.
CURRENT PROJECT:
-Paying off a massive amount of debt in college loans.
-Working in television.
Commercial games are being greatly discriminated here tho (no GOTW, most of the time no frontpage even tho it does deserve it, people voting thumbs down while not even looking at it), so that could put more people away from making commercial games. If more people could see what MMF can do (by looking at commercial games with Fueled by Fusion on it) more people would try to make their own games and get the community moving again.
For me it's never as fun as it was before. Making games just isn't as much fun as playing them unless you are onto something really good.
Also i'm trying to find the right project, thats why you've seen a few demos from me in the past six months and no actual games. Ive got about six games on the go at once, I still can't decide which one to put all my effort into.
Dustin:
I had finished a few games a long, long time ago, way before TDC even existed. Back in the old, old days when female klikers made up about 5-10% of the community, instead of around 0.01% as it is. Back when I had 5 hours a day to work on something instead of the current 1 hour per day (where most of it consists of waiting for MMF to open up examples just to get more ideas).
Hmm... I suppose some of you do have a point. A game is only fun to make when you could see it being finished. I guess I get demoralized trying to do graphics AND coding at the same time, normally ending up doing a half-arsed job at both, not being satisfied with it, then re-doing it. I've already re-done Combatant about 4 times (not including the fact that it's a remake of Arena Fighters) and re-did Chaos on Earth about 2-3 times.
I put commercial games on the front page. Well, only Meeklits. Most commercial games aren't even fun, much less worth putting on the front page. We (I) discriminate against commercial games no more than I discriminate against normal freeware games just as boring.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
1st August, 2005 at 01:16:29 -
Kliking was sooo much fun when making a fan game (and decompiling others), and still is somewhat. Now all I do is get really fustrated with bugs and the community's standards. Making anything but simple games (or team projects) bores me. Although if I am ever bored on a project, I'll take a break every 3 hours or so to go make a simple Nintendo fangame, built in movement included.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
DaVince This fool just HAD to have a custom rating
Registered 04/09/2004
Points 7998
1st August, 2005 at 06:05:25 -
It's easy for me: If I can get something hard to work, I'm happy. And I will automatically have fun.
same here. My really early games were so crap (worst than the webstone spiderhead) that only I was able to play it. But i had so much fun when making them because I didn't care what people thought.
Now only high standard games get people's attention and the crap ones which people enjoy making get flamed it.
I was less enjoying the game I was making since I had to "hype" some parts up.
In short games are no fun and we should express how we want to games no matter what happens
i got really bored of the same old game making routine after Titan Omega so i tried a new method. i now make most of the soundtrack before even opening MMF. seems to work too. been steam-heading along with a new project all cuz making the music added a new kind of excitement.
Ad for demo's i never release them. except the Shikun one, which really was abandoned till an old community went ape over it.
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
But Kliking has begun to evolve. We need to change with the times. Besides, now we (or at least some of us, not inculding myself) can produce products that could go on the market.
How many commercial 2d games have you seen in the last year? (excluding GBA and phone games)
- Ok, you must admit that was the most creative cussing this site have ever seen -
A lot of people have ignored my Space invaders clone (8 downloads after 3 days) and that was much more fun that making a platform game. Simpler, quicker and easier too.
I miss when TGF was new and everyone made games with built-in engines and ripped graphics. But now, everyone has custom engines and original graphics... ARGH! That means that i must do the same, and be honest now, how boring isnt it to create a custom engine? ARGHGH!H!!!
To be honest everyone's waiting for MMF2 and in the meanwhile Clickteam's marketing activity is comparable to a dead horse. So there aren't many new people showing up.
- Tigerworks
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
7th August, 2005 at 18:07:33 -
Possibly Clickteam was relying on the users to advertise? I came to KNP because I saw a splash screen on a KNP game. Now everyone has MMF or TGF pro and no one gives credit to Clickteam, except in the credits. Possibly splash screens (as annoying and unprofessional as they were) were a good thing? I don't know, I could be totally wrong, because I'm guessing.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
Designing an engine, having great visions about it is fun. Having your hard work come to life is fun. But working for hours on a custom engine, only to realise that it doesn't work well due to MMF's timing, object handling, and event-based system is not fun.
I kinda miss the days when I'd make some object based ball-movement AI where some guy would hide in the shadows of a tree (on the opposite side of the enemy), fire a few shots, and take cover. It worked so damn well I watched it for an hour . The turret was firing at the people who popped out from trees, sometimes hitting them before they could dodge, or sometimes the people were lucky enough to get enough shots through to destroy the turret.
I'd do it again, but my standards have gone up way too much to use crappy-looking people and turrets anymore .
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.
Yeah, major letdowns on ambitious engines due to MMF's problems and shortcomings is never fun... but finding crazy workarounds for those problems makes it all the more satisfying in the end.
Go Moon!
Peblo Custom ratings must be 50 characters or less
Registered 05/07/2002
Points 185
9th August, 2005 at 01:34:11 -
Yeah, like a real programming language.
"Isn't it always amazing how we characterize a person's intelligence by how closely their thinking matches ours?"
~Belgarath
DaVince This fool just HAD to have a custom rating
Registered 04/09/2004
Points 7998
9th August, 2005 at 05:29:02 -
Most real programming languages don't have shortcomings, Peblo.
On advertising; MMF2 is not far away so there'd be minimal benefit from strong marketing at this point. There's no point in promoting MMF, and it could be another six months till we see MMF2 so there's no point in advertising that either.
I hope when they do begin marketing again it's geared towards a more mature user. I don't think I could handle an influx of retarded little kids.
Well I did help clickteam a little, I posted my games on some Final fantasy forum and someone asked what I used to make them, I directed them toward clickteams webpage. But being Final fantasy fans they will probably go for rpgmaker in the end.
Still if we all did that we would only get 1 or 2 new 'Clickers' if any.
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Anyway, yeah, I'd say kliking is still fun, though not nearly as fun as it was when everything you made in TGF was the best thing in the world in your eyes, only because you thought libs were cool & that everyone would love your game. I can imagen that this is how almost all newbies feel about there still though. After they slowly progress & become better though, there expectations get higher & they put more stress on making sure that its actually good. Thats prolly why it doesnt seem as much fun anymore. Your more bent on making something quality, unlike before when ever anything you did seemed like quality to you. Even if it didnt to everyone else.
. The turret was firing at the people who popped out from trees, sometimes hitting them before they could dodge, or sometimes the people were lucky enough to get enough shots through to destroy the turret.